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30-Jan-2011, 4:39 AM
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#1
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Greater Seattle Area
Posts: 4,773
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Hill Top Antenna Linked via Wifi
This is just a wild pipe dream...
But for someone with a serious OTA reception habit who happens to be blocked by terrain but has access to a hill top and a few bucks to spare...
The idea is to place a network attached tuner at a remote antenna that can then be accessed by a PC at the desired viewing location. A clear line of site needs to be available for the WIFI link.
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If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)
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26-Apr-2011, 11:53 PM
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#2
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 28
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Thats Awesome! My only concern would be the bandwidth to keep up with 2 HD shows being recorded. I guess you could drop some cat5 down the hill but you would could only get 300' 
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27-Apr-2011, 4:14 AM
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#3
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Greater Seattle Area
Posts: 4,773
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdubb
Thats Awesome! My only concern would be the bandwidth to keep up with 2 HD shows being recorded. I guess you could drop some cat5 down the hill but you would could only get 300' |
You're right, the Wifi link would need to be rock solid. To record one HD show while viewing a second HD show live could require an error free 48 MB/s WIFI link, something that would require a true line of site and a substantial fade margin. 100 Mb/s Wifi bridges are available... http://www.radiolabs.com/products/wi...ess-bridge.php Depending on circumstances, 802.11 a, g or n may be the best choice. There are unlicensed 900 MHz radio options possible as well.
Or, if you really have access to the needed right of way, there are long haul options for twisted pair such as http://www.patton.com/products/pe_pr...ory=416&tab=sp Capable of a 45 Mbit/s link out to 0.9 KM or more. Also, Ethernet over RG-6 and RG-11 devises are on the market. EnConn is one of several vendors I have seen, but none have been in hand.
Of course, there are all sorts of other variations on this concept. If power is available, a PC at the remote site can be the PVR/DVR. This would reduce the load on the WIFI link provided you would be satisfied to download recordings when live programing is not filling the link.
A similar system could be run from a remote location with power and internet access. Products like Slingbox come to mind.
__________________
If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)
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Last edited by GroundUrMast; 21-Oct-2011 at 9:07 AM.
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9-Jan-2014, 11:08 PM
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#4
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Greater Seattle Area
Posts: 4,773
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With the new HDHR PLUS, this idea might become a bit more practical. http://www.silicondust.com/products/...run/hdhomerun/
The ability to trans-code MPEG-2 to H.264 in stand alone hardware reduces the bandwidth needs dramatically.
__________________
If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)
(Please direct account activation inquiries to 'admin')
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2-Mar-2016, 6:30 PM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GroundUrMast
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What's the distance from the hilltop to your house?
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4-Mar-2016, 4:36 PM
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#6
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Antennas Direct Tech Supp
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,942
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Tom hasn't visited the forum since last fall....
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9-Jul-2016, 7:46 AM
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#7
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Greater Seattle Area
Posts: 4,773
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoman94
What's the distance from the hilltop to your house?
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My opening post began with, "This is just a wild pipe dream..."
At present, I'm located atop a hill, but surrounded by trees that are more than 100' tall. If not for the trees, I'd have line of site to most transmitters in my area. 
I recently bought a couple of Ubiquiti products, a NanoLoco-M2 and an airGateway. Both devices have a combination of wired and wireless connectivity options. I have been extremely pleased with the performance of the NanoLoco-M2 when configured as a bridge or access-point. With a clear line of site, the manufacturer claims that the NanoLoco-M2 can maintain a 5Km point to point link... I've not tested that yet, but based on my experience thus far, I actually believe the manufacture's claims are true.
Now that I'm feeling healthier, I need to get out and play with the hardware...
__________________
If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)
(Please direct account activation inquiries to 'admin')
Last edited by GroundUrMast; 9-Jul-2016 at 8:53 PM.
Reason: sp.
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16-Nov-2016, 11:50 PM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Eastern Ohio
Posts: 101
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I had a similar problem decades ago with a motel that couldn't pick up TV off antennas because of a hill top a mile away
I created a passive repeater on top of that hill by connecting two 8bay bowties back to Back
I simply pointed one toward the stations and the other one toward the motel
That motel became the only motel in the area that couild get all the networks
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17-Nov-2016, 6:58 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 341
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Did the 8bays have reflectors?
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4-Dec-2016, 12:09 AM
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#10
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WIRELESS ENGINEER
I had a similar problem decades ago with a motel that couldn't pick up TV off antennas because of a hill top a mile away
I created a passive repeater on top of that hill by connecting two 8bay bowties back to Back
I simply pointed one toward the stations and the other one toward the motel
That motel became the only motel in the area that couild get all the networks
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Now THAT is interesting. May I ask for some details on how you did it?
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17-Dec-2016, 2:50 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Eastern Ohio
Posts: 101
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Sorry, just now looked at this thread again
You can simply take two high gain antennas and connect them together with a short jumper
Aim one toward the broadcast towers and the other one toward your antenna
You could even use a high gain preamp on the antenna facing the broadcast towers for more gain
Commercial systems that do this are available today but back then none were around
Imagine a 30 db gain preamp receiving a TV station on a 15 db gain antenna then sending it back out through another 15 db gain antenna
60 db gain in signal level coming toward your house is huge
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19-Dec-2016, 3:58 AM
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#12
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 75
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Thanks! I may have to mess around with this idea a bit...when it gets a little warmer. 
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23-Dec-2016, 7:45 PM
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#13
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Greater Seattle Area
Posts: 4,773
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WIRELESS ENGINEER
Sorry, just now looked at this thread again
You can simply take two high gain antennas and connect them together with a short jumper
Aim one toward the broadcast towers and the other one toward your antenna
You could even use a high gain preamp on the antenna facing the broadcast towers for more gain
Commercial systems that do this are available today but back then none were around
Imagine a 30 db gain preamp receiving a TV station on a 15 db gain antenna then sending it back out through another 15 db gain antenna
60 db gain in signal level coming toward your house is huge
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I'm pretty confident that there is no regulatory problem with a passive (no amplifier) relay, but I'd want to double check the current FCC regulations before adding any active device to a relay system like this.
__________________
If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)
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27-Dec-2016, 8:01 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Eastern Ohio
Posts: 101
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This technology is actually being used every day in the cell phone industry
Millions of amplified repeaters are in use in this country in cars, homes, stadiums, airports,malls, businesses, hospitals, etc
None of these units are passive.
Many of these units are using 80db gain amplifiers
Prio to 2014 their use was totally unregulated.
Today the FCC only requires users to inform their carrier that they are boosting their signal with one
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29-Dec-2016, 8:05 PM
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#15
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Greater Seattle Area
Posts: 4,773
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I'm sure you're right about the technology...
I'm simply suggesting that it would be a good idea to be familiar with the the limits imposed by the FCC. EDIT: Tower Guy correctly refers to CFR 47 part 74 (see post 16 below) In particular, https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/74.732 paragraph (g) appears to be very relevant.
__________________
If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)
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Last edited by GroundUrMast; 17-Mar-2017 at 8:51 PM.
Reason: Remove reference to CFR 47 part 15
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29-Dec-2016, 8:44 PM
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#16
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Delmar, NY
Posts: 1,236
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The legality of a TV on channel booster is in FCC rules part 74. The rules say that they must be licensed individually. The key to a workable booster is to place the antennas far enough apart such that the isolation between them is 30 db more than the gain of the amplifier. Filters must be used to limit out of band interference. If I were in your shoes I'd try it before I licensed it.
Last edited by Tower Guy; 29-Dec-2016 at 8:53 PM.
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31-Jan-2018, 12:34 AM
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#19
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Greater Seattle Area
Posts: 4,773
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Quote:
Originally Posted by welkin
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At home I'm using two Unifi AP-AC-LR access points to cover my property with very reliable Wifi signal. I've used the NanoLOCO-M2 and the AirGateway products for a couple of applications. I'm quite impressed with the performance and reasonable cost of all these Ubiquiti products.
__________________
If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)
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2-Feb-2018, 7:00 PM
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#20
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 81
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Funny I was just thinking about this the other day.
Staring at the hill in front of my house and thinking it would be nice to have a tower up there with a with a narrow beam OTA to WIFI converter repeater.
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