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Old 17-Sep-2015, 4:28 AM   #1
Sorzy
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Is this is or can I get more?

OKay my fellow OTA cut the cable/dish/directv tvfool.com members. I'm new to the forum and to this new age of OTA reception and everything required to receive it, so, please, bare with me. Anyhow, I apologize in advance for this being so long. I tried to break it up rather then make it all one blob of a paragraph as some do.

Here's the 411.
I live just about the same distance from Chicago and Milwaukee. To round the miles up, let's say 38-50 miles from the both cities and or broadcast towers. So, I can and am getting channels from both cities. And from the print outs I have of channels finders, it appears all the towers are pretty much in the same direction/area. That being, about 165 true and about 355 magnetic. They do very up and down from there so I just went with the most common direction. And it's what I used when it was on the ground and hooked up and got 81 channels. So, I figure, that's pretty darn good and close enough.

Here's my current set-up. Need to know what, if anything, I can do to get more channels then I have. Or, at least what I had when it was in the ground. As explained here. >>>> Before I list my set-up, let me say and point this out. Before putting my set-up on my roof, I assembled it before and hooked it up to one TV. As it's currently split between two TV sets. One a smart TV and one just an HDTV.

Anyhow, I assembled it as it currently sits on my roof. But I put my set-up one the ground in my yard, total height was like 10 feet including the tripod. Barely cleared the wooded privacy fence of my neighbors. Anyways, I hooked it up to the bedroom smart TV and got 81 digital and 1 analog channel. Woooooo Whoooooo right?

Well, that was until I put it on the roof. that bedroom smart tv only found 63 digital and 1 analog channel. Still good but not the 81, or more I was hoping for and expecting since it was now twice as high if not more. And the living room LED HDTV only found 56. And again, it's now like 20-25ft in the air.

Anyhow, here's my set-up.

http://www.amazon.com/Antennas-Direc.../dp/B00C4XVOOC

http://www.amazon.com/Winegard-LNA-2...0_SR160%2C160_

https://www.antennasdirect.com/store...ty_tripod.html

https://www.antennasdirect.com/store...opic-Mast.html

Now, as I'm sure you'll see, the antenna is strictly UHF. Being able to get both cities channels, I don't care if I get CBS/WBBM out of Chicago as I can get Milwaukee's CBS channel, WBME I believe it is. So right now, I'm not concerned with a VHF antenna. But if or when I am, I'm looking at this one...
https://www.antennasdirect.com/store...V-antenna.html

I bought a 50ft. Quad Shield cable for the antenna to the house connection. Which connects outside at a little line in/line out juntion point (how Cable, Dish or DirecTV did it and they all used it I believe. Anyhow, from there it runs into the crawl space. Maybe a 3 food section of Quad Shield or Dish cable. I then installed the Winegard amp to the cable from that point in the crawl space. Then hooked the other end up to a gold plated line in set 1 and set 2 lines out splitter (already had one new in a package so I used it). And as a matter of FWIW or FYI, I think the gold plating does nothing). Anyhow, ran another cable, not quad but it's good cable, from set 2 to the smrt tv in the bedroom. But I plan on that one with more quad shield when I can afford it. But I don't think that's why I'm not getting as many channels. But the main reason I don't think I am is because I'm splitting the signal? Yes? No?

So, there's one question to one issue. Am I getting less channels, even thought it's higher up because I'm splitting the signal between 2 sets? Even though they're both not on at the same time if ever at all. Can I use 2 amplifiers or can or do I have to use one amp for or to, each TV set, per line? Or is that not possible or advisable?

The DB8E came with a UHF splitter/combiner. I ran the antenna out to the amp antenna in and then hooked my 50ft. cable to the TV side and as I said, ran that to where the Dish cable went on the outside. Ran a cable direct from the smart tv in the bedroom to set 2 on the splitter. Ran a separate cable, one of the Dish ones which I believe is quad shield? But it's connected by itself to set 1 on that splitter.

But in the end, the signal still gets split does it not?

Another question, or maybe, concern I have, has to do with grounding it all.

Now, on the outside where the Dish came in at, I noticed that connection junction has a ground screw. One of these things here...http://www.ebay.com/itm/Single-groun...item1ea3a2ae07

So, I ran some solid wire, 12 gauge I think, to the ground rod already there which is where my Com Ed meter is grounded.

Do I have to and should I also ground the tri-pod/mast/antenna on the roof? Or is how I grounded it fine? Will that ground the entire system? And see, here's another thing I should point out; My home was built in the 60's and I have slatted plaster walls with that nasty messy blown insulation in the attic. And being a ranch, and having a hip roof, I felt mounting it in the attic, should you wonder why I didn't, would not only leave me with little room, but it's a mess to deal with. Thus why I put it on the roof. But because I did, and because I have slatted plaster walls and that nasty blown insulation, I had no clue where I could run the cable and be sure I'd get it into the crawl space without trying 100 times (yes, I'm exaggerating but dead serious), and make it to the crawl space.

So, I had to run it down the roof. And again, being a ranch with a hip roof, I have gutter on all 4 sides. So, I had to run it over the gutter and then down. I zip stripped everything to the mast and tripod. But rather then put even more holes in my roof, I just put a dab of roof sealer under and then on top of the cable n multiple spots to hold it in place. As well as sealed everything else or anything I felt needed sealing. Then used some plastic cable holders to attach it to the underside of my aluminum fascia under the gutter as well as underneath on the soffit as I came around and over the gutter, after creating a rain drip loop, then I ran it down the vinyl siding, again, using those straps every so often to hold it secure and connected it to that Dish junction (line in, line out junction that goes into the crawl space). Tried to find a picture of it but had no luck. Besides, the more I think about it, it's just another place I could have or end up with an issue. So, I think I'll just remove it and bring the antenna cable straight into the crawl space through the same hole and just seal it back up. Believe me, I hate the thought of running a ground wire from the tripod/mast the same way. As I saw nothing on the roof I could ground it too.


I thank any and all who reply with help and suggestions. And though I have other things I'd like to ask and or talk about, I'm pretty must done for now because doing what I did over the past few days, caused me a lot of pain. So, I just wanted to get the main things down and see what, if anything anyone had to say.
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Last edited by Sorzy; 17-Sep-2015 at 4:43 AM.
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Old 17-Sep-2015, 3:32 PM   #2
rabbit73
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Hello, Sorzy:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorzy View Post
I mean, I waited 3, 4 maybe 5 days and emailed the webmaster twice. And I admit, the 2nd email you could tell I was frustrated with why it was taking so long.
You were lucky. Some new members have had to wait over two weeks when there was a shortage of moderators.
Quote:
I tried to break it up rather then make it all one blob of a paragraph as some do.
We appreciate that. It makes it easier to read.

To help us make a better analysis of your situation, please tells us your town or city and do a tvfool report by going here and entering your exact address (which will not show) or exact coordinates (which will be shortened) and give us the URL link in bold type near the top of the report:
http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opti...pper&Itemid=29

If you are not able to do it on that page, use the interactive map browser and move the cursor to the antenna location, and click on >>Make Radar Plot:
http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opti...pper&Itemid=90

Quote:
I just went with the most common direction.
What direction was that? For best results the antenna should be aimed directly at the transmitters.
Quote:
Before putting my set-up on my roof, I assembled it before and hooked it up to one TV.
That's a good way to do it; it gives you a baseline for comparison.
Quote:
Anyways, I hooked it up to the bedroom smart TV and got 81 digital and 1 analog channel. Woooooo Whoooooo right?
Sounds good to me, especially since you started the project on your own.
Quote:
I bought a 50ft. Quad Shield cable for the antenna to the house connection.
Quad Shield coax RG6Q isn't usually necessary unless you have a serious local interference problem; ordinary RG6 is OK.
Quote:
Which connects outside at a little line in/line out juntion point (how Cable, Dish or DirecTV did it and they all used it I believe.
You have to be careful about reusing some dish equipment, it might not be suitable for OTA. Using their coax can be OK.

Is this your setup?
DB8E > coax50' > grounding block > preamp > power inserter > splitter > 2TVs

The best location for a preamp is close to the antenna.

Quote:
The DB8E came with a UHF splitter/combiner.
Is it an ordinary splitter or a UHF/VHF combiner? What does it say on it? Can you show us a photo or gives us a link? How are you using it?
Quote:
So, there's one question to one issue. Am I getting less channels, even thought it's higher up because I'm splitting the signal between 2 sets? Even though they're both not on at the same time if ever at all.
It is possible that you are getting fewer channels because of the splitting and longer cables. It is also possible that the higher location for the antenna isn't as good as the lower test location because there are trees or buildings in the way. We need to see your tvfool report.
Quote:
I think the gold plating does nothing
gold plating reduces corrosion which might give a bad connection
Quote:
Can I use 2 amplifiers or can or do I have to use one amp for or to, each TV set, per line? Or is that not possible or advisable?
You don't usually need a preamp and a distribution amp before splitting, unless all your signals are weak, and you are feeding many TVs with long lines.
Quote:
So, I ran some solid wire, 12 gauge I think, to the ground rod already there which is where my Com Ed meter is grounded.
The wire from the grounding block for the coax to the house electrical system ground should be 10 gauge copper. Be careful not to disconnect the house electrical system ground even for a moment, when you are connecting the ground wire from the grounding bliock and the grounding wire from the mast.

The coax shield should be grounded with a grounding block that is connected to the house electrical system ground with 10 gauge copper wire for electrical safety and to reject interference. For further compliance with the electrical code (NEC), the mast should also be grounded in a similar manner to drain any buildup of static charge, but the system will not survive a direct strike.



Todd Humphrey doesn't speak for the NFPA that publishes the NEC code, but he has some ideas that are helpful. The local electrical inspector has the final say if you are willing to get him involved. Some inspectors are more friendly than others; a local electrician could tell you.

Satellite System Grounding
Part 2 - NEC Overview
Presented by Todd Humphrey
http://www.dbsinstall.com/diy/Grounding-2.asp
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Last edited by rabbit73; 17-Sep-2015 at 3:36 PM.
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Old 17-Sep-2015, 6:06 PM   #3
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The DB8e's included combiner is a very good hybrid combiner/splitter, nothing more or less. It has no filtering.
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Old 18-Sep-2015, 4:43 AM   #4
Sorzy
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Thanks for the replies guys. And rabbit73, I'm going to do my best to reply and answer some of what you replied.

First, let me correct myself. As I read your reply to it, I saw it wasn't the best way to describe which direction I aimed the antenna/s.

Anyhow, by common direction, I meant the true and or magnetic heading. And by that I mean, if most of the channels I can get and the broadcast towers are in that same general direction, I went with the most common one. Meaning, if WLS, WGN etc., etc., etc., all had a true heading of 165, and others were 169, which some were, I went with the one that had the most. In this case, towards Chicago it was a/the heading of 165. And because it's close, I'll still get those at 169. They just might not be as strong of a signal. And as for the Milwaukee towers, I used the heading of 355 and again, anything close to that I'll still get those stations. And again, just might not be as strong a signal.

I went back up on the roof today, with the help of a neighbor to hold the ladder which I had to get up on, on the roof, to reach the antenna, I tweaked the direction/heading of each one and after doing so I re-scanned and now have 73 channels on both TV's. Even got WGN and it's 2 other channels.

After looking at your diagram for the proper way to ground my antenna/mast and cable/s, it does appear that I need to run a ground for the mast and tripod. The only issue I have with it is the way I'll have to do it. Why? Because I have an older home and it has blown insulation in the attic and it's a mess and nasty to deal with. That combined with having slatted plaster walls, I couldn't guarantee I'd be able to get it into the crawl space or into a wall to where I could do it how they might or would in a newer home, a cable wall plate. So, like I believe I said previously, I had to run the cable over the gutter. Which means I'd have to do the same thing to ground the mast/tripod. And I'm not sure that's not only not a good idea, but I'm also not sure if it gets seen by the cities building inspector, if it would be a problem or not?

As for going with quad shield, I am in the flight path of a local airport and having two taller houses, one on each side of me as well as one nasty, messy smelly brings around all sorts of critters and birds mulberry tree (not on my property or I'd of cut it down the day after we moved in, lol), in the Chicago direction/side of the antenna, I didn't not want to get it and wish I had because of interference. One of those things where, I'd rather of done it and not need it then not do it and wish I had ya' know. lol Another reason I went with or want to use quad cable is because my home is older and I don't know how well the wiring in it is grounded. Being an older home who knows what previous owner/s did that I don't know about or haven't found yet. :/ Don't know if I can get interference from wiring or not, but again, rather not deal with it either way if quad cable will help.

Side note, the 50ft. from the antenna to the house is a tad long and I had to coil it up. So, first chance I get I'm going to cut it to and replace the end so I don't have 10ft. of it coiled up. And 25ft would have been too short. And there really isn't any place close to me anymore where I could have gone and had the proper length made.

My set-up is DB8E, mast & tripod (obviously), 50' quad cable to a single line ground block (which I will replace, maybe with a gold plated one because I honestly have no clue how long it's been there) then from the single line ground block is about a 3ft. ext. of Dish cable to the Winegard LNA-200 Boost XT power supply then to the gold plated splitter (1 line in 2 lines out) then obviously from there to the two TV's.

FYI...The amp is a few feet below the antenna, so if it went bad I could get to it without a ladder or taking the mast out. Then as I said, after the ground block there's about a 3ft. piece of Dish cable (was already there from when we had Dish, and after/connected that is the power supply for the amp and then the 1 into 2 splitter.

So, in short, yes, your assumption of my hook-up/set-up is correct. But again, I do see I'll have to ground the tripod/mast. Just don't like the way I'll have to do it. That being the same way I had to do the quad cable, over the gutter. I see I'll also have to re-do the ground block with 10ga.. And then too, I'll just use the 10ga. for the tripod/mast/antenna ground. Again, just have to hope there's no code violation in going over the gutter with the quad cable let alone the ground wire.

And FWIW, I've decided I'm not going to bother getting a VHF antenna. I can't see spending any money just to get one channel. A channel that I can and do get out of Milwaukee. That being...CBS

And once again, I apologize for another short story. lol Just like to be thorough and it doesn't make sense to post 6 different times when I can post just once. I also apologize if I repeated anything. Anyhow, if I missed something and or you need more info and or want to know something else, just ask and I'll do my best to answer as soon as I get see the email notifying me that someone posted to the thread.
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Old 18-Sep-2015, 11:32 AM   #5
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A good success story!

The extra coax cable is inconsequential since it's extra insertion loss is covered by the preamp's gain. Just leave it coiled up and keep it out of the way.
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Old 18-Sep-2015, 7:06 PM   #6
Sorzy
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Thanks guys. It is appreciated. Just need to get the tripod, mast and antenna grounded with some 10ga.. Thing is, it's already stormy around my area. :/

And since you wanted to see the map for me, and I didn't get to that because I think I got it figured out, I thought I'd go ahead and post it anyhow. Even though it's after the fact. Because maybe someone will point something out I missed or need or could to do? Ya' never know.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...8e03bd0716c10e

P.S.

I tried to do the google earth thing but I just couldn't figure it out. I downloaded everything as instructed, including the thing for my area, and I couldn't get it to work. And as previously mentioned either in this thread or someone elses, in case you missed it, I'm not a techie or a geek. Just an end user and most of the time I can figure it out, though not this time, as well as when it comes to computers, hardware and most especially software, I know just enough to do some things and yet just enough to get me in trouble with other things.
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Old 24-Sep-2015, 12:04 AM   #7
Sorzy
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Okay, might not look great but I grounded my tripod, mast and antenna. The cable was and as previously mentioned in another post, already grounded at a single cable grounding block.

And for the most part, everything works great.

However, as I've now had the antenna and everything associated with it up for a full week or so now, I've found that there are many, too many for my liking, times, day and night, when channels, day or night come in great. Meaning, 7-10 strength bars and the db's in the high twenties and low 30's for some even. Then there are those times, when channels, any time of the day or night, where I completely lose them even though I've had them as mentioned above. And it's not raining, windy or anything else. Maybe a little dew on the antenna. But I'd think that would affect all channels if that were the reason?

As an example. In my area, UHF band, I get AND channel 7 and channel 9 WGN. According to the information I have, both those stations are at the same true and magnetic headings. Yet I'll completely loose channel 9 WGN and any others, meaning, besides 9-1, I also lose 9-2 and 9-3, but I still get, with great strength, channel 7. Thanks GOD I went with multi-directional and can get similar if not the same channel and show.

But then I've also had the reverse. A Milwaukee station that once came in great, as defined above, no longer comes in at all. It's not all day or all night, but long enough to irritate the hell out of me.

So, I ask. Do I have an issue? An underlying issue? Or is this normal these days for free OTA digital TV? Because they turn their broadcasts down or off because they prefer betting money from the cable and satellite providers and just want to irritate the hell out of us in the hopes we'll get or go back to that?

Lastly, can I run another amp or amplified splitter, after the Winegard LNA-200 (that seems to working just fine for me), and after the 2 set splitter I have that has the previously mentioned Winegard amp, in front of it?

Again and as always, will and do appreciate any and all help/replies!!!
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Old 26-Sep-2015, 2:31 AM   #8
rabbit73
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Thanks for your tvfool report and your reception report.
Quote:
Then there are those times, when channels, any time of the day or night, where I completely lose them even though I've had them as mentioned above.....Yet I'll completely loose channel 9 WGN and any others, meaning, besides 9-1, I also lose 9-2 and 9-3, but I still get, with great strength, channel 7..
Quote:
But then I've also had the reverse. A Milwaukee station that once came in great, as defined above, no longer comes in at all. It's not all day or all night, but long enough to irritate the hell out of me.
Which way is your antenna aimed, both panels for Milwaukee or both panels for Chicago? Or is it one DB8e panel for Milwaukee and one DB8e panel for Chicago?

Your tvfool report is only for zip code. All we know now is that you are in Zion. Please do another report using exact address (which will not show) or exact coordinates (which will be shortened); maybe it will give us a clue about what is going on.

Are there any trees or buildings in the signal paths from Milwaukee or Chicago? Can you post photos that show us what the antenna "sees" in those directions?

Quote:
Because they turn their broadcasts down
They don't turn their broadcasts down like AM stations at night. They only turn them down if there is transmitter trouble. And they certainly don't turn them down to please the cable companies that are their rivals.
Quote:
Lastly, can I run another amp or amplified splitter, after the Winegard LNA-200 (that seems to working just fine for me), and after the 2 set splitter I have that has the previously mentioned Winegard amp, in front of it?
Let's hold off on that to see what is going on. If necessary, it would be to replace the passive splitter with an amplified splitter like the Channel Master 3412 after the power inserter.

One possibility would be to remove the reflector screens from the DB8e so that it would be bi-directional with the panels side-by-side aimed in the same direction.
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Last edited by rabbit73; 26-Sep-2015 at 3:01 AM.
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Old 28-Sep-2015, 5:53 AM   #9
Sorzy
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Hey Rabbit73...Thanks for the reply.

As to which way do the panels on the BB8E face, one panel faces Milwaukee, at 355degrees and the other panel faces Chicago, 165degrees.

As for are there any trees, towards Milwaukee, none that pose an issue. As for thep anel pointing towards Chicago, there is a tree but I do not believe the ends of any of its branches were or are causing any problems. I say this because if they were, I'd lose every channel or lose most of the signal strength for every station. When I lose channel 9-1, 9-2 and 9-3, I still get 7-1, 7-2 and 7-3 as well as 5-1 and 5-2 and a host of others.

On my living room TV, I can view the signal strength from the self diagnosis section in the menu. The strength is shown in bars from 0-10. I also can see the db's. And even though channel status says lock and the signal strength is at any given bar from 0-10, I notice the db's are constantly changing. If I were more tech savvy and had a better camera or cellphone and could do it right in one take, I'd make a small video to show you what I mean/am talking about. But then from what I can tell based on your replies, I don't think I need to as I'm pretty sure you understand.

And again, when I lose 9-1 and it's sub-channels, even though they're the same tower or tower direction as channel 7 (Chicago), I'm still getting 7 and the signal strength is anywhere from 7-10 bars.

And I'll hold off on removing either reflector or having them only face one direction until it's the only thing left to try. Plus, they're riveted on and once removed, I'm pretty sure that voids the lifetime warranty. lol

FWIW, I bought the necessary tool, had the stripper already, to put the proper end on cable and I'm going to shorten the cables in the crawl space the come from the splitter and go to each TV. Don't know if it will help or not. But I figure it definitely can't hurt. lol

As for maybe getting the Channel Master 3412, to clarify, by installing it after the power inserter, by power inserter do you mean the power supply for the Winegard LNA-200? And if so, would it be installed after the power supply and before the 2-way splitter? Or after both the power supply and 2- way splitter? Just a little confused about that part and thought I'd better get clarification. Also, instead of the Channel Master 3412, I was looking at getting this one....
https://www.antennasdirect.com/store...amplifier.html

I'll research the two and find the differences, besides price later today or tomorrow.

Oh, and before I forget, living near an airport, and being in the flight path for one of it's 4 runways, if only for a moment, I even get the occasional interference when certain planes/jets come in for a landing or take off even. Certain planes as in the bigger corporate jets like Gulfstream's and up. But that's far more rarer then completely losing channels. Today, even though I once got them in, I lost or didn't get about 8 channels. However none were channel 9-1 and it's sub channels. But then I was watching football and was on 58-1 Milwaukee and switched between 6-1, again, Milwaukee), when it's signal would drop, and I'd switch to 32-1 out of Chicago. Until it's signal dropped and I'd switch back again. Found myself on 6-1 mostly because it was just coming in better. Which means I just might have to get on a ladder on the roof, with the neighbors help again, and tweak the panel facing Chicago? But first I'm shortening the cables. Between the 50' before the power supply and splitter, plus what's after the splitter, the total is most obviously and most definitely over 50' and quite possibly over 75'.

Lastly, to avoid a small novel, lol, I only want to say one last thing. And it's in regard to my saying "Because they turn their broadcasts down". I only say that, and kind of believe it, because greed tends to be the rule anymore these days. And let's be honest. We ALL know they make more money having their contracts with cable and satellite providers and only make money from commercials with OTA signals. I mean, proof of that is in watching 6-1 today. They had an alert from AT-T U-Verse telling viewers who have AT-T U-Verse that they could miss out on football, baseball, Empire and other shows and sporting events because of a contract dispute.

I tell you what, I don't miss that crap. But it tells and says to me that it's all about the almighty dollar. Or, GREED. I mean, do you remember when cable first came out? hat was the big sell? No commercials right? Now, more then ever, it seems that's all there are. Count how many commercials you get with/in OTA broadcast, or cable or satellite even, as well as time how much commercial time there is against how much show time you get in between commercial breaks.

And now I promise, lol, this is really my last comment in this reply/post. THANK YOU FOR REPLYING AND YOUR HELP RABBIT73!!!
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Old 28-Sep-2015, 8:00 PM   #10
rabbit73
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Quote:
As for maybe getting the Channel Master 3412, to clarify, by installing it after the power inserter, by power inserter do you mean the power supply for the Winegard LNA-200? And if so, would it be installed after the power supply and before the 2-way splitter? Or after both the power supply and 2- way splitter? Just a little confused about that part and thought I'd better get clarification.
It goes here:



Quote:
Also, instead of the Channel Master 3412, I was looking at getting this one....
https://www.antennasdirect.com/store...amplifier.html
That would work, but keep in mind that a 4 output DA of either brand has less gain than a 2 output DA.

If you are going to feed 3 TVs and one coax line is much longer than the other two, you can do it like this:



The diagram shows using two passive splitters, but you can replace the first passive splitter with a 2 output Distribution Amp.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg LNA200snip2.jpg (95.0 KB, 862 views)
File Type: jpg Efficient3waysplit2_1.jpg (59.6 KB, 1332 views)
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Last edited by rabbit73; 28-Sep-2015 at 8:11 PM.
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Old 28-Sep-2015, 11:42 PM   #11
ADTech
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Quote:
That would work, but keep in mind that a 4 output DA of either brand has less gain than a 2 output DA.
Actually, to be specific, both have about the same amount of amplification (15-16 dB) but one has only a two-way splitter while the other has a second cascade of two port splitters so as to provide four outputs. The net gain of each is different by about 4 dB due to the extra layer of splitting.

The requirement to use of BOTH a preamp and a distribution amp would be a rather rare occurrence and is usually only required when there are extremely long cable runs both between the pre-amp and the distribution point and again from the distribution point to the final outlet. It just isn't really needed very often.
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Last edited by ADTech; 28-Sep-2015 at 11:44 PM.
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Old 28-Sep-2015, 11:57 PM   #12
Sorzy
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Join Date: Aug 2015
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Originally Posted by ADTech View Post
Actually, to be specific, both have about the same amount of amplification (15-16 dB) but one has only a two-way splitter while the other has a second cascade of two port splitters so as to provide four outputs. The net gain of each is different by about 4 dB due to the extra layer of splitting.

The requirement to use of BOTH a preamp and a distribution amp would be a rather rare occurrence and is usually only required when there are extremely long cable runs both between the pre-amp and the distribution point and again from the distribution point to the final outlet. It just isn't really needed very often.
Thanks for the reply ADTech.

Your reason of using a powered splitter in regard to the long run of cable is 1, why I was considering getting and thus using one. But, then also why before I do anything, I'll be shortening the run of cable from the antenna to the single ground block, 50' where I have like 10' extra. As well as I'll be shortening the cable I used after the splitters, as it was the cable from when I had Dish and the installer left it quite long.

But if I were to add up all the cable, no matter where it is, it's total is over 100'; Which consists of the 50' from the antenna to the single ground block and then about a 3'ft. jumper from the ground block through the wall to the inside and to the power supply for the Winegard LNA-200 and then after the splitter there's at the very least another 50' between the cables going to the two TV's. So, I'm hoping that by the time I get done shortening all the cable, I'll be closer to If not under 75'.

Not sure when I'll get to it as I'm fighting a couple bulging discs and one herniated disc still. But it will be done soon as the weather is a changing.

Thanks again to you guys for replying and offering your expertise.
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