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Old 14-Jul-2010, 1:51 AM   #1
frogtog
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TV Reception - Help

I live in Grand Rapids, Mi and have had my area special royal 17 anenna for about 3 yrs now. I have a 12db preamp at the antenna and am trying to figure out how to better my signal especially public tv WGVU 35. I have 3 HDTV tv's. Two must have better tuners because I get good signal 95 percent of the time with all channels. One a vizio lcd tv. The other is in my desktop pc which came with a haupphage tuner. The problem is with my Sony 57" which does not get good signal thru my Samsung ATSC tuner. Woodtv8, WZZM13 and 17 seem to be ok but WGVU 35 cannot be picked up 90 percent of the time with this tv.

I was told that I could do one of 2 things, or both. (1) Replace the 12db with 25db amp (2) replace the uhf element pointing to 35 with a vhf since they are now digital (3) do both.

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Last edited by frogtog; 14-Jul-2010 at 3:18 AM.
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Old 14-Jul-2010, 3:44 AM   #2
John Candle
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What is a area special royal 17 antenna ? . And where did you get it ? Looks to me like 35.1 is 11.1 . What is the model number of the Samsung ATSC Tuner ? Older model stand alone ATSC tuners do not do well with multipath signals.

Last edited by John Candle; 14-Jul-2010 at 5:58 PM.
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Old 14-Jul-2010, 3:57 AM   #3
frogtog
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area special is a 3-element antenna on one mast made by channel master several yrs ago b4 the transition to digital.
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Old 14-Jul-2010, 9:42 AM   #4
mtownsend
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frogtog View Post
area special is a 3-element antenna on one mast made by channel master several yrs ago b4 the transition to digital.
This may explain the problem. If the antenna was optimized for WGVU when it was on channel 35, then it will not work so well now that WGVU has moved to channel 11.

I believe this antenna was a combination of 3 separate antennas that you could aim at the different groups of transmitters. The one that you aimed at WGVU (compass heading 280ยบ) was probably cut to optimize reception in the middle of UHF (around channel 35).

WTLJ is also in that direction on channel 24 (originally channel 54 analog). This channel is still on UHF, so it probably comes in fine even after the channel change.



You might want to try experimenting with rotating your antenna. Your peak VHF reception is probably pointed in a direction that is sub-optimal for WGVU. By turning your antenna, you can at least see if your Samsung tuner is able to pick it up with better antenna positioning.



The root cause of your problem is probably multipath rather than signal strength. Multi-directional antennas like this are taking in signals from many signal paths, including signals that might bounce off of buildings, trees, or the surrounding terrain. Since the length of the signal path between the transmitter and your antenna is different for each of the possible bounced signals, they show up at your receiver as if they were delayed "echoes" of each other. If this was an analog TV signal, these "echoes" would show up as "ghosts" on your screen.

For digital TV, these multipath echoes can interfere with your receiver's ability to decode the digital data stream. Some receivers are better at coping with multipath than others (newer generation chip sets are generally more robust than older ones and there are some differences between chip set vendors). Your Vizio and Hauppauge devices might be using newer/better chip sets than your Samsung tuner.

It is possible to improve reception on older chip sets by cleaning up the signal going into it. If you had a single directional antenna pointed at WGVU, it would probably be clean enough for your Samsung receiver to work (because any multipath signal coming from the sides or back of the antenna would mostly be ignored).

With some experimentation on your current antenna setup (and a bit of luck), you might be able to find a middle ground where you can keep your multi-directional setup while still being able to pick up WGVU on your Samsung receiver.

If that doesn't work, then you'll have to consider other options:

1) Switch to a different kind of antenna setup. A single antenna with a rotator will greatly cut down on multipath, but you'll need to turn the antenna to view stations from different directions.

2) Replace the Samsung receiver with something that uses a newer chip set.

3) Get a new TV (all new TVs have built-in ATSC tuners, and most of them use newer chip sets).
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Old 14-Jul-2010, 11:50 AM   #5
kb2fzq
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I agree mtownsend, but additionally, he's driving 3 TV's with what I would consider a substandard antenna and probably several splitters....he's really pushing the envelop, even with the pre-amp included...
A better, directional antenna probably WOULD help across the board, but then there's transmitter location issues, which are in multiple directions, which, inevidably, as you said, will result in a rotor...it all depends on how seriously he wants better and more stations and how much he wants to spend to get it ...
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Old 15-Jul-2010, 8:16 PM   #6
John Candle
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Smile Reception

This suggestion , install a winegard HD 7084P antenna pointed at channel 19. This All channel antenna will also pick up PBS 5 main transmitter. . If the coax wiring is a mess , clean it up. Install a three way splitter and have single and seperate runs of RG-6 coax to each Tv location. Install the 3 way splitter in a place that is easy to get at , do not put the 3 way splitter in a monkey swinging , death defying place. The >>StartMAPS<< part of tvfool shows the locations of the television transmitters. Install all this and see what the signal levels are at tv locations , then you will know if a antenna amplifier is needed.
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