Aren't Canadian "pending" in operation now?

[Maury Markowitz]

I was using Maps to see what I could get in our Oshawa-area home. It comes up with many analog stations and only a few digital.

When I click "Pending" all the analog ones remain, and many more digital ones appear.

But isn't everything in Canada digital now?

[mtownsend]

Yes. Most of the digital transmitters are operating and the analog transmitters are shut off, BUT the Industry Canada database has not caught up with that fact yet. The IC database still lists most analog transmitters as "operational" (currently on the air) and digital transmitters as "authorized" (might go on the air at any time).

We don't know when Industry Canada will update their database with the correct classifications. In the meantime, if anyone reports specific updates to us, we will work them into our internal processing pipeline wherever possible. At least that way, our live reports and maps can be a little more up to date while we're waiting for the IC updates.

[Maury Markowitz]

Ah ha, thanks!

[be236]

For Vancouver stations, most of the *main* stations in there are digital now (except for CHEK 6 analog still, temp)...

Here's a fairly accurate URL info.. maybe you can update for those particular BC stations?

http://members.shaw.ca/nwbroadcasters/digitaltv.htm

[Maury Markowitz]

I found a list here:

http://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/sp_dgse...g/gg00026.html

Which seems to be much more up to date. How often do you scrape the files?

I'm a bit of a file conversion guru, if this is something you'd consider automating, I'd be happy to help. dBASEIII format, LOLZ! Way to go retro, IC!

[mtownsend]

Originally Posted by Maury Markowitz

I found a list here:

http://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/sp_dgse...g/gg00026.html

Which seems to be much more up to date. How often do you scrape the files?

We download these files daily. This is exactly the data we're talking about that needs to be updated.

Many of the analog transmitters that are currently marked "operational" need to be changed to non-operational or removed from the database. Many of the digital transmitters that are currently marked "authorized" need to be changed to "operational".

Some analog transmitters are still operating, and some digital transmitters are not yet operational, so it is actually important to have individual records checked and matched with the real-world status. We hope that IC is working on this and will have a comprehensive update that brings us closer to the current real situation.

[PhotoJim]

I can advise you that the following Regina, Saskatchewan stations have all gone digital:

CKCK-DT former 2, now 8 (virtual 2.1)
CFRE-DT 11 (11.1 HD, 11.2 SD) (already in your database)
CBKT-DT 9 (9.1)
CBKFT-DT 13 (13.1)

The retransmitters in nearby communities are, as far as I know, all still broadcasting in analog.

I also know that CFQC-DT 8 (8.1) in Saskatoon is now broadcasting digitally. I suspect that CFSK-DT has moved to a VHF channel but can't confirm. CBC Saskatoon is still analog.

Jim

[tvlurker]

What happenned to the canadian stations? They're almost all gone now?

[abnutcracker]

is there any intentions to update the DTV content hear for the Canadian content ,so we can get info for ALL broadcasters ?

http://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/sp_dgse...g/gg00073.html

http://spectrum.ic.gc.ca/engineering...TVContours.zip

version.txt shows 2012-03-19

[mtownsend]

Originally Posted by abnutcracker

is there any intentions to update the DTV content hear for the Canadian content ,so we can get info for ALL broadcasters ?

I'm not sure I understand what you're asking for. What information would you like to see that is missing from the site?

[abnutcracker]

Well for ex. for DTV

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...de65b7df85fb17

Still shows analog for CDN content .CHWI-TV 60 is now CTV2 at 26.1 as 16.1 is the retransmit for CTV2 for Wheatley area.

CBET 9 is 9.1

[mtownsend]

The TVContours.zip file appears to only have data up to 6-Oct-2011. The version.txt is newer (19-Mar-2012), but the data files themselves do not appear to be very recent.

Just FYI, we already pull in data directly from the site at http://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/sp_dgse...g/gg00026.html. We process the files available under "Broadcasting database files (ZIP, 5 MB), updated daily". As far as we can tell, this is the most up-to-date information publicly available from Industry Canada.

Prior to the digital switchover, many of the digital transmitters were marked as "AU" (authorized) and the analog transmitters were marked as "OP" (operational). After the switch, IC changed some of the digital transmitters to "OP" and removed some of the analog records which were turned down. However, their process of updating the database seems to have slowed down.

We were hoping that IC's database would eventually catch up to the real status of active transmitters, but we're not sure when they will actually get around to cleaning it up.

[tvlurker]

Originally Posted by mtownsend

We were hoping that IC's database would eventually catch up to the real status of active transmitters, but we're not sure when they will actually get around to cleaning it up.

It appears that the delay in updating the database is partly due to how it is being done -- no changes are made until the broadcaster files its certification information to indicate that the AU facility is operating as per the original engineering brief. Once that happens, the DT facility is supposed to be promoted to "OP", and the former analog facility is supposed to be deleted from the public version of the database.

Some times there are delays in getting all the i's dotted and the t's crossed. Other times, there seems to be some confusion when there are multiple entries associated with a given station.
Furthermore, there is no real policy established yet for what to do with returned licenses (SunTV, the upcoming CBC and TVO analog TV shutdowns on July 31, etc.)

There is also a request pending to make available entries that correspond to CRTC Part I applications, which are currently not available in the public version of the databse. (This means that the engineering brief and other technical details involved in a Part I (expedited) application are available on the CRTC website, but not in the public version of the IC database.)

[canant]

@mtownsend

Are you sure TV Fool's database is properly updating with Industry Canada information? I have been looking at Industry Canada's database for TV stations (http://spectrum.ic.gc.ca/engineering/engdoc/baserad.zip) and the analog channels 8 CHAN-TV, 32 CIVT-TV and 17 CIVI-TV have been dropped from that database since at least mid-April (I looked at the database back then), yet TV Fool is still listing those analog signals for the Vancouver, BC area. In addition, CIVT-DT moved from channel 33 to 32, and this is reflected in the Industry Canada's database, but not on TV Fool.

[canant]

There appears to be continued issues with syncing to Industry Canada's database.

17 CIVI-TV (Vancouver, BC) is still showing up and as mentioned in my post 5 weeks ago, has been off the database since mid-April 2012.
2 CBUT (Vancouver, BC) was removed from Industry Canada's database by May 23, 2012.

Both are still showing up on TV Fool.

[canant]

Originally Posted by tvlurker

It appears that the delay in updating the database is partly due to how it is being done -- no changes are made until the broadcaster files its certification information to indicate that the AU facility is operating as per the original engineering brief. Once that happens, the DT facility is supposed to be promoted to "OP", and the former analog facility is supposed to be deleted from the public version of the database.

Of the mandatory markets DTV transmitters 1/3 are still showing as status AU, not OP.

When I looked at the database couple of weeks ago, every single CBC/SRC digital transmitter that was activated or changed parameters at the August 31, 2011 transition deadline is still in status AU.

[abnutcracker]

Originally Posted by tvlurker

It appears that the delay in updating the database is partly due to how it is being done -- no changes are made until the broadcaster files its certification information to indicate that the AU facility is operating as per the original engineering brief. Once that happens, the DT facility is supposed to be promoted to "OP", and the former analog facility is supposed to be deleted from the public version of the database.

Some times there are delays in getting all the i's dotted and the t's crossed. Other times, there seems to be some confusion when there are multiple entries associated with a given station.
Furthermore, there is no real policy established yet for what to do with returned licenses (SunTV, the upcoming CBC and TVO analog TV shutdowns on July 31, etc.)

There is also a request pending to make available entries that correspond to CRTC Part I applications, which are currently not available in the public version of the databse. (This means that the engineering brief and other technical details involved in a Part I (expedited) application are available on the CRTC website, but not in the public version of the IC database.)

Well as pointed out the broadcasters are still taking their time reporting back based on the latest response below ..So is up to the public to get the broadcasters to get this done as it seems after a period of time we are still waiting ?
.

The process of updating the TV database is done on a regular basis by Industry Canada. As soon as the certification process is completed, the banner of the station will change from AU to OP. The reason why some of the DTV stations are still 'AU' in the database is that Industry Canada is still waiting for some documentation from the station/broadcast consultant in order to finalize the certification process. All the analog stations that are no longer operational are removed from the database. As soon as Industry Canada receives the information from the broadcasters that their stations are no longer operating, they update the database accordingly.
If there are still some stations that should be removed from the database, please inform the Spectrum, Information Technologies and Telecommunications Sector at Industry Canada at 1-800-328-6189, and they will investigate and make the necessary corrections.

I've recently been finding conflicting information regarding which channels are still analogue, which have switched to digital, and which have gone off-the-air. Another tool I often use in conjunction with TV Fool, RECnet's FCCdata, has "Allotment" as the "status" for many low-power stations, especially community-oriented ones. However, yet another channel list for British Columbia from a company called Global-CM (http://www.global-cm.net/TV%20CAN-BC.pdf) lists quite a few stations/translators that aren't currently listed on TV Fool OR FCCdata, so I'm not really sure what the current state of things are.

What I do know, at least based on the sources I've found, is that ALL analogue television in Canada will be permanently off-the-air as of 2022 (Wikipedia statistic). Meanwhile, some community broadcasters are upgrading to digital while others seem to be remaining in analogue at least for the time being.

The official database - at least the one that seems to be official, is here: https://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/smt-gs...g/sf11281.html (scroll down to bottom of page for channel list table). Be aware, though, that it does seem to be a bit... old (as in "2015" old).

Hope this helps.