Sterling, Alaska TV Fool Report

[ripper]

Here is my TV Fool Report:
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...d2433510f08a13

I have what I think is a VHF/FM antenna, based on my google image search of similar looking antennas. It is about 8ft long or so and arrow shaped. All the rods are in the horizontal plane, so I don't think there is any UHF on it. It is a roof mount about 25 feet above ground. I've got the 300/75 converter at the antenna and RG-6 directly to our one TV, which is a LG 50" plasma from about 2008. No splitters, no amps.

I basically have two options. I can point West (262 deg) towards Kenai, or Northeast (35 deg) towards Anchorage. Kenai is much closer and has a stronger signal so I tried that first but got puzzling results.

All stations are broadcast from the same tower. However, I can only get two stations, K03FW and K09QH when I point at 262. I tried tweaking it a little each way, but with no change. All the stations from that direction are VHF, so I should be able to pick them all up with my antenna. Any idea why I can only get two stations when there are 6 stations all broadcasting from the same location 12.5 miles away? Could it be a tuner issue? Could it be that a couple of the rods on the antenna are a bit out of whack? There are a couple that are slightly bent, but I put them back to about where they should have been.

So, I decided I'd try pointing at 35 deg toward Anchorage. There I can get all the VHF stations just fine at a distance of over 65 miles. I don't get any of the UHF stations, which is another reason I think my antenna is VHF/FM. The only extra stations available from the Anchorage area on UHF are FamilyNet and Ion, which I don't really care about too much, so it makes no difference to me if I point towards Kenai or Anchorage. I just want to get the 4 networks, PBS, and MyNetworkTv, which are broadcast from both directions. I'm thinking Kenai is the better direction though since KTBY and KTVA might be tough to get even with a good UHF antenna due to weak signal.

So, either I need to figure out why I can't get the rest of the Kenai channels, or I need to add a UHF antenna and point towards Anchorage.

Any ideas on what my best options are?

Thanks!

[ADTech]

That would suggest that the other translators at Kenai might not be on the air. I'd suggest contacting their operator(s) first to find out less you spin your wheels over what might be a temporary condition.

[ripper]

I know that they are on the air because coworkers living closer to the tower get them with indoor antennas. That's why this is so puzzling to me.

[StephanieS]

How old is your antenna and coax?

I would first make calls to the operators of each of those translators as ADTech suggested to confirm broadcast, then you know you have a system problem.

Lesser quality 300/75 ohm transformers have been known to fail.

[ripper]

The antenna and coax were probably new with the house, circa 1997. I confirmed again with my coworkers those stations are on the air. They are pulling them in with indoor antennas. I'm sure it wouldn't hurt to upgrade the antenna and cabling, but surely that wouldn't cause some stations to come in and some not to, especially with the amount of signal strength there. Like I said, I have no problem pulling in stations from 65 miles, so why I can't pull these from 12 miles is puzzling, especially when they are all transmitting from the exact same tower.

One thing I thought of last night was that I was doing the adjustments and channel search last Friday night. Perhaps my timing was terrible and I was doing it in the middle of some disruption from the solar storm and those stations were down temporarily. I need to get back up there and try aiming it at 262deg once more to rule that out I suppose. But that would be a pretty giant coincidence since there were no local reports of outages due to the CME.

[tomfoolery]

It's interesting that the three you can't get all have co-channel interference flags.

[ripper]

I noticed that too, which was one thing that had me leaning toward it being a tuner problem. But I can't really understand the co-channel issue. Looking at the radar plot, there is nothing in that direction to interfere with. And I definitely have a directional antenna, so I find it hard to believe that there is a co-channel problem.

Channels 8, 10, and 12 have co-channels about 123 degrees apart, with significant signal strength differences, so I have a hard time believing that is the problem. I am simply stumped.

By the way, as a newbie here, I really appreciate all the info on this site and all the help the regular posters provide. It is definitely useful and appreciated!

[StephanieS]

This is where you have to start eliminating possible issues.

If it's a tuner issue that is suspect, test reception with another TV. See if any of those signals lock. I notice different behaviors between my two TVs when it comes to what locks and what doesn't.

Co-channel situations can be mysterious things. Even if very weak, an off axis co-channel signal can disrupt your tuner from locking on to a stronger signal.

If that persists with another tuner revising your antenna system might be an option. Going after the UHF signals at magnetic heading 209 with no co-channel issues might yield the reception you want.

Magnetic 209 has K31MD-D (FOX), K44LE-D (NBC) and K29KH-D (CBS) in line of sight conditions.

When you say you receive Anchorage at magnetic 8, are you receiving PBS, NBC and ABC reliably? If so, you may be able to add UHF reception to your existing VHF antenna, combine antennas and get the major networks.

Cheers.

[ripper]

OK, I've been gone for a bit but now I am back to tackling this problem. I need to get after it before the snow keeps me off the roof!

I tried magnetic 245 again, and still only get K03FW and K09QH. Therefore I can rule out solar storm potential from the last time I tuned. And coworkers are still receiving the other stations, so I am certain they are on the air.

From magnetic 8, I am receiving NBC (KTUU), ABC (KYUR), PBS (KAKM), and MyNetworkTV (KYES) reliably. Do you think if I add a UHF I can pull FOX (KTBY, -8.1 NM) and CBS (KTVA, -14.1 NM)?

The way I see it, I can try a different tuner or a different antenna.

I don't have another TV in the house to try a different tuner. So I'd have to buy one. I may buy a smallish one to put in the tack room in the barn, so this might be an option.

If I try a different antenna, I think I have 3 options.

-Buy a smaller external VHF/UHF combo antenna like a Antennacraft 5884 and point at magnetic 245. This should get me all the major networks, provided my current antenna is somehow the problem.

-Buy a new large directional antenna like a Winegard HD8200U and point at magnetic 14. This should get me the major networks, plus some of the minor UHF stations. However, would the 8200 be enough to pull in KTBY and KTVA? (-8.1 NM and -14.1 NM respectively.)

-Build a Gray Hoverman (which sounds like fun!). But most of my major network stations are on VHF-Hi (at magnetic 8) or VHF-Lo (at magnetic 245). My understanding is that the GH is best at UHF and is OK for VHF-Hi.

Regarding co-channels, it is interesting that the stronger stations (with weaker co-channels) like K12LA don't come in. But weaker stations (with stronger co-channels) like KTUU at magnetic 8 come in fine. Still not sure how this could be the problem, but you never know.

Regarding cabling, is RG-59 OK for OTA, or do I need RG-6? I've got lots of extra RG-59, but no extra RG-6 if I wanted to re-run the cables.

Any other thoughts and ideas are appreciated!

[StephanieS]

You are doing better than your report suggests in terms of Anchorage.

If I had your results and just wanted to add CBS and FOX, I'd combine an Antennas Direct DB8e to your VHF system and aim the DB8e to magnetic 209 and catch those translators mentioned above to complete your set of major networks. Those translators would hold more promise than a double digit negative db signal.

Your VHF performance is quite good, I don't think you have a system issue. If you were having cabling issues, I'd expect the red shaded Anchorage signals to not be reliable as the weakest signals would be gone.

Antenna 1: Existing VHF
Antenna 2: Antennas Direct DB8e. Both panels to magnetic 209
*mount DB8e 4' below VHF antenna

Combine antennas via a Antennas Direct EU385CF combiner.

You haven't mentioned how long your coax run is. However, with one TV unless you are at a very long run, a preamp is likely unneeded.

I'm approaching this from the standpoint of what gets you the last two signals you want.

Cheers

Originally Posted by ripper

From magnetic 8, I am receiving NBC (KTUU), ABC (KYUR), PBS (KAKM), and MyNetworkTV (KYES) reliably. Do you think if I add a UHF I can pull FOX (KTBY, -8.1 NM) and CBS (KTVA, -14.1 NM)?

The way I see it, I can try a different tuner or a different antenna.