Help required on antenna choice and positionning.

[Stephan26]

Hello all from Canada!

I, like some others, am looking at possibly dropping my cable company. We usually find ourselves watching movies/series that we've downloaded via our HTPC or simply from the web itself (netflix, NHL gamecenter etc)...So why keep paying for the 1 or 2 channel we sometime watch and that i could possibly get free via OTA?

So i was directed to your site and starting looking around trying to set my mind on what i should buy. I'm a "amazon" buyer so i found on there a Terk FDTVO antenna that started this whole OTA search and i've now found a good deal (?) on a DB4 at 53$...

What are your thoughts in a proper setup for my area, to be able to pull in HD stations such as TVA, CBC, FOX, NBC and the such from an attic installation if possible...

is a booster required for any typical installations...?

I hope this is the correct address that i need to be posting:

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...0b867e6f5e4022

Thanks!

[Dave Loudin]

The DB4 will probably work. It's not nominally designed for channels 7-13, but most of the channels in that band available to you are very strong. It might not have enough gain for reliable reception of WVNY, the US ABC affiliate broadcasting on ch. 13. My hesitation iscomes from not checking the beamwidth (sector where the antenna is sensitive) of the DB4. You have about 100 degress separating your Canadian locals from most of the US stations, and many antennas cannot "see" over that wide a spread.

A premium "set-and-forget" solution would be an Antennas Direct C5 aimed at 225 degress (magnetic). It's primarily a VHF antenna, but has very modest gain over a wide beamwidth for UHF channels, which is precisely what you need.

Unless you're going to have over 50 feet of coax between antenna and TV, you should not need a pre-amp. If you were to check the signal strengths reported by your TV without one installed versus strengths reported with the pre-amp installed, you'll probably notice an increase. However, this increase buys you nothing, as the background noise has also been equally amplified. DTV reception is all about signal-to-noise ratio, not just signal power.

If you haven't already, I would check our recommendations against a community of Canadian OTA folks at Digital Home. In the reception results sub-forum, there are threads for every TV market. Post your query there.

[GroundUrMast]

Dave's suggestion is simple and straight forward.

Your mention of a HTPC prompts me to suggest you consider a multiple tuner, multiple antenna option. http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=820

If this option seems overly complex or expensive, I understand. On the other hand, if you want more information feel free to ask.

[Stephan26]

Thanks Dave for the feedback. I've also posted my questions on the Digital Home forums.

I am completely not understanding the VHF UHF point though. I thought, that what i wanted was a UHF antenna, to get the "better" reception ?? I thought VHF was on its way out? Are you saying, that i should look into a VHF antenna, which would in turn allow me to capt UHF? Sorry if i sound like a complete idiot, but this is only my 2nd day "searching/reading" on this OTA and its possibilities...

@GroundUrmast. Thanks for the input, i'll go and take a look at your post about my HTPC.

Thanks!

[GroundUrMast]

If you look closely at your TVFR, notice the column titled 'Channel - Real'. You'll see that most real channels are UHF (14 and higher). However there are several VHF channels (2 through 13) listed. Contrary to a fairly common belief, television broadcasting on VHF has not been eliminated, though UHF is favored due to lower interference levels in that band.

Who knows what the government will do tomorrow, but for now, you and I both have DTV signals available to us on VHF frequencies.

The C5 is a good option in your case because it is capable of receiving UHF but offers gain in the VHF band which is needed to give you reliable reception of the VHF signals that are a bit weaker than most of the UHF signals.

As I have already suggested, there are other ways to approach your situation, but for most folks, simple is usually the best. Again, compliments to Dave.

[Stephan26]

Thank you both for the comments/suggestions.

Apart from the c5, which is a bit more pricey than the Db4, would the db4e be just as good? Seems to have this wider beamwidth than the previous db4 model. Any other models i should consider? Someone from the Digitalhome site mentioned using a Channel Master 4221? That person is about 20km away from me...seems to say he gets good reception...

I mean, can i really go wrong choosing between any of those antennas? (db4, db4e, c5, 4221)

Thanks again. This should be my last query!

[Dave Loudin]

The 4221, db4, and db4e are all the same style of antenna, an array of bow-tie elements in front of a screen. This type of antenna is designed for UHF channel reception, with the db4e being the newest design optimized for channels 14 - 51. These all have some sensitivity to VHF frequencies. My hesitation with recommending one of these is how useful that performance will be in your case.

(Please have your TVFool report in front of you for the next part.)

Note that all of your Canadian stations - UHF and VHF - to the southwest are very strong. You do not need an antenna with positive gain to successfully receive them. The US stations are weaker and will need a few dBs of antenna gain for reliable reception. A set-and-forget antenna solution will end up pointing between those two directions, biased a little towards the US stations.

The deciding factor in my opinion is which antenna will get you WVNY without losing any others. I am not sure that the 4221 will do that. I am pretty sure the C5 will.

[Stephan26]

Fair enough! Thanks Dave and Groundurmast for all the info and being patient with my somewhat basic questioning! I truly appreciate it. Now i will be on the hunt for a C5 at a good deal!

[Stephan26]

Just another quick concern though...Looking at some websites to find a deal, i came across this:

Technical Details

    ClearStream 5 HDTV Antenna / High Band VHF HDTV Antenna - Channels 7-13. Used to compliment a UHF antenna set-up.
    A UHF/VHF Combiner is included in the antenna box

What is this "Used to compliment a UHF antenna set-up"? If i base myself on your posts, i will be able to get both VHF and UHF with this C5 correct? We are talking about this antenna right?

http://www.amazon.com/Antennas-Direc...pr_product_top

[GroundUrMast]

Originally Posted by Stephan26

Just another quick concern though...Looking at some websites to find a deal, i came across this:

Technical Details

    ClearStream 5 HDTV Antenna / High Band VHF HDTV Antenna - Channels 7-13. Used to compliment a UHF antenna set-up.
    A UHF/VHF Combiner is included in the antenna box

What is this "Used to compliment a UHF antenna set-up"? If i base myself on your posts, i will be able to get both VHF and UHF with this C5 correct? We are talking about this antenna right?

http://www.amazon.com/Antennas-Direc...pr_product_top

Yes, that's the C5 antenna.

Without discrediting the C5 option, you could install two antennas. One aimed at the Canadian stations and the other at the US stations. A pair of Winegard HD7684P antennas would be a premium solution. (Referring back to the multiple tuner, multiple antenna idea.)

[ADTech]

The C5 was designed for the purpose of VHF 7-13 reception, usually as a complement to an existing UHF antenna. After we were selling it for a while, we were finding that a good number of customers were returning the UHF antenna and saying that the C5 was doing the job by itself. We then had the design engineer go back and run new simulations to characterize the UHF performance for the C5. These simulations are included in the Tech Data Sheet listed under "Documents" on the product page for the C5 on our website.

I generally characterize that C5 as being "long-range on high-VHF, short-medium range on UHF" with its UHF performance somewhat resembling that of an imperfect omni antenna.

As an example, the St Louis market in which our office is located is an all-UHF city. We've only had one antenna on the roof of our building for the last year - a C5.

Hopefully this clarifies the descriptions you've seen about the C5. Please note that we are not the Amazon seller and have no input onto their listings of our products. We already have our hands full trying to keep our own website updated - a project which never ends and always has room for improvement.

[Electron]

Start with the C5 aiming direction at about 225 degree magnetic compass. Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html . Here are places to by antennas and etc. in Canada. http://www.saveandreplay.com , http://www.trentondistributors.com .