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Old 25-Aug-2020, 8:48 PM   #1
BigBean
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Cool FM Reception

I think this is the correct place to post this:

https://i.imgur.com/G2rF9cP.png


So, I'm farting around with my TV antenna and was going
to experiment with stacking an FM whip to it, despite knowing
that my Antennas Direct db8e is relatively weak on the VHF
band ... now I'm thinking of chucking the whip altogether
( methinx it's a Magna Dynalab ST2, unsure because I can't
find the paperwork ), but I think I need a directional antenna
pointed SW to get the coveted lower FM band, aka "college
radio". There's a number of lower power stations from that
area and was thinking at least a 4-element Yagi might do
the trick. The problem is that a number of American Yagis
are no longer on the market, such as the legendary Antenna
Craft FM6. Am I on the right path here?

Also in consideration is the distance of the UHF antenna:
it is mounted roughly 6' away. Small house so options are
limited on placement, what with the cable length issues.

Thanks!

Last edited by BigBean; 25-Aug-2020 at 9:32 PM. Reason: Signal Analysis URL not working.
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Old 25-Aug-2020, 11:37 PM   #2
OTAFAN
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Hey BigBean:

I think you're barking up the right tree, although your FM Report looks challenging with the one edge reception at your end. However, give it a go and see what you get. Here's a link to Amazon for FM Antennas of various sorts, including Winegard and an Omnidirectional with good reviews:

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=fm+antenn..._ss_ac-o-p_4_5

As far as the distance away from your UHF antenna, 6' is probably OK. I have two antennas at my location, one above the other with about 2' between and have not seen any interference. I'm in a fairly strong signal area about 35 miles south of Mt. Wilson in SoCal LA/OC. Your "mileage" is probably different than mine though. But give it the "Old College Try" and see what what you pick up. Keep the forum posted, please.

http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=16583

All the best.....

Last edited by OTAFAN; 25-Aug-2020 at 11:59 PM.
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Old 25-Aug-2020, 11:51 PM   #3
rabbit73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBean View Post
I think this is the correct place to post this:

https://i.imgur.com/G2rF9cP.png

I think I need a directional antenna pointed SW to get the coveted lower FM band, aka "college radio". There's a number of lower power stations from that area and was thinking at least a 4-element Yagi might do the trick.
Hello, BigBean

Thanks for the FM report image. I see you found out that the FM reports don't link like the TVFool reports. There is a way to do it, but it is complicated.

Which low power stations, by callsign, are you interested in receiving?

FM Yagi antennas are getting hard to find. Newark has the Stellar Labs 30-2460:
https://www.newark.com/stellar-labs/...nt/dp/97W3565#



Six feet away is OK, unless the UHF antenna is in front of the FM antenna.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Stellar Labs 30-2460 FM Antenna2.jpg (101.0 KB, 235 views)
File Type: jpg BigBeanTVFreportFM2.jpg (318.9 KB, 227 views)
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Last edited by rabbit73; 26-Aug-2020 at 12:16 AM.
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Old 26-Aug-2020, 5:18 PM   #4
BigBean
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Thumbs up

Hello again, all!

Yes, I'm a pain ... I finally figured out that my TV/FM idea was
NOT going to work anywhere on Earth, so I'm opting to improve
what I've got up there already. Since the TV antenna has a poor
response to VHF, there's no point. So I'm aiming both arrays back
towards Hartford and getting the best signal possible from up there.

Next, I plan on buying a Yagi, possibly the Stellar, as indeed it's very
hard to find ANY dedicated FM antenna now, and stacking my existing
whip atop that mast. By itself it's OK, but I can do better.

Yep, I've been looking at FM antennas and sad to say they're either
nonexistent or very pricey. There's a group doing good recycling work
up the road in Harwinton, they repurpose scrap metal and turn it into
antennas. They offer a 10-element model that has ridiculous gain on
it ( I realize gain isn't the only sell factor here ) and the maker claims
to get Boston without an amp ( nope, not considering one ) when
pointed that direction.

Seems most antennas are sold in Europe nowadays, plenty of stock
out there, but shipping can be pricey.

A fellow at a local electronics parts store thinks that due to the expense
of transmission, many stations are going to resort to a streaming-only
model. Dunno about that.

I'm going to have to do this in steps as it's going to take multiple trips
up on the roof to get 'er done.

Finally, I'm looking to grab WPKN out of Trumbull, which is a small
10kw station. I may grab a few others along the way, who knows.
I get it now on my MX117 tuner but it's weak. That ridge to the west
is a good chunk of the problem.

Thanks again!

Last edited by BigBean; 26-Aug-2020 at 5:22 PM.
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Old 26-Aug-2020, 11:04 PM   #5
rabbit73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBean View Post
Finally, I'm looking to grab WPKN out of Trumbull, which is a small
10kw station. I may grab a few others along the way, who knows.
I get it now on my MX117 tuner but it's weak.
This is what the WPKN-FM transmitter site looks like:



This is the coverage area for WPKN:



Quote:
That ridge to the west is a good chunk of the problem.
Very true; it blocks the direct signal:



Attached Images
File Type: jpg BigBeanTVF-WPKNsatView2.jpg (162.4 KB, 212 views)
File Type: jpg BigBeanTVFcovWPKN2.jpg (165.2 KB, 214 views)
File Type: jpg BigBeanTVFp2WPKN2.jpg (128.5 KB, 212 views)
File Type: jpg BigBeanTVFpathWPKN2.jpg (169.8 KB, 210 views)
__________________
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Last edited by rabbit73; 26-Aug-2020 at 11:11 PM.
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Old 28-Aug-2020, 4:33 PM   #6
BigBean
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WOW Thanks, Rabbit! Is that Google Earth? I haven't used it in awhile.

Yeah, that looks like the SECOND ridge, as we're in a little valley. There's
a hill across the street to the West, then beyond TriMountain that higher
ridge. I've heard folks who live atop it can receive NYC and I believe it.

The thing that kills me is, once again, tech has passed me by. I remember
seeing an Archer in a Radio Shack years ago. All gone. That Stellar is perhaps
one of the very last Yagis still available. There's that small outfit up in Harwinton
that makes Yagis out of scrap metal but they're pricey.

For the Hell of it, not FM, but when I was on the roof yesterday, I stuck a Mr LongArm
pole in the southern-directed array of the DA db8e and instead of the higher VHF band,
I got interference instead. This knocked out 3/4s of my stations, so I removed it, turned
the array back towards Hartford and turned The FM Trap back on. Got my original 46
channels back. I sure hope this Channel Master amp proves itself; it's dangerous up there!

Thanks, Guys.
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Old 29-Aug-2020, 5:39 PM   #7
BigBean
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Q: Is there a database here or there that has a roundup
of antenna specs? I've got a line on a couple of RCAs but
they don't give the gain.

I suspect to get PKN I'm gonna need serious gain to pierce
that ridge to the West.

Thanks!
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Old 29-Aug-2020, 10:27 PM   #8
OTAFAN
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Solid Signal has specs on their antennas that they currently sell as well as those no longer available. Winegard manufactures many of RCAs outdoor antennas and the specs would be the same for their equivalent models.

https://www.solidsignal.com/c.asp?c=...tennas-Outdoor

Ever forward BigBean.....
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Old 30-Aug-2020, 3:42 PM   #9
BigBean
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OTAFAN View Post
Solid Signal has specs on their antennas that they currently sell as well as those no longer available. Winegard manufactures many of RCAs outdoor antennas and the specs would be the same for their equivalent models.

https://www.solidsignal.com/c.asp?c=...tennas-Outdoor

Ever forward BigBean.....

Depressing, isn't it?

STILL The Europeans won't give in. They have a lot of choices
where we do not ... except perhaps getting lucky on eBay.
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Old 30-Aug-2020, 4:00 PM   #10
BigBean
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Cool

Here's an interesting article:

https://www.kopn.org/about/antenna

To receive a signal from this frequency, a dipole of 10.99'
is required, as that's the length of the wave. That's a pretty
big area. So right there, I'm looking at that size.
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Old 30-Aug-2020, 4:48 PM   #11
BigBean
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Cool

... but since a half-wave is all that's required,
I'm looking at just under 5'.

And, it seems this one is still available:

https://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=HD8200XL

That just may fit the bill.
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