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Old 23-Aug-2012, 4:21 PM   #1
BlueRidgeVA
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Cut the Cable in the mountains

Hello all,

I'm new to OTA TV. We just cancelled our DirecTV account. We've been streaming using ROKU (highly recommended if you have fast internet connection (ours is about 4Meg). But we don't get the networks real time so I'm looking at an antenna.
Here's my reception report.
I'm on a downhill lot facing about southeast, but have a good view to the 77 azimuth. We're only interested in picking up the signals from the channels at the 77 azimuth. I should be able to mount the antenna on the downhill exterior side of the house facing the transmitter. I would like to test whatever antenna I get from inside the house, about 4 feet below the final antenna mounting location, and behind one exterior wall. The test would be with direct cable to the receiver. The actual cable route to the receiver might be a bit circuitous (down to ground level, into crawl, connect to existing cabling, then up to receiver). I can see from the report that reception is possible, but I'm not sure about dB loss from cabling, etc. to figure out how I might get this to work.
I'd appreciate any advice, equipment recommendations, etc.
Thanks in advance
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 5:15 PM   #2
signals unlimited
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Simple DTV reception solutions

Due to the hills between you and the transmitters you will need a fairly large antenna capable of reception of channels 7-51 mounted above the roof line.
If your best spot is on the lower end of the roof you should be ok provided you have a view to the transmitters and the rear of the antenna clears the roof by at least three feet . The type of antenna you need will not easily mount on a wall.

Install a Winegard HD7697P High VHF/UHF antenna and a Winegard AP-8700 pre-amplifier. The amplifier has a power supply that must be installed ahead of any splitters. You can use your Satellite coax, but remove any splitter/diplexers and replace with splitters designed to pass DTV 5-1000mhz.

The amplifier will make up for the 5db per 100' loss in your coax and splitters 3db loss per port if used.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 5:41 PM   #3
No static at all
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I recommend the Antennas Direct 91-XG antenna with a Winegard 4800 pre-amp. Charlottesville is an all UHF market, so there is no need for a larger combo antenna.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 5:46 PM   #4
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Tv Reception.

A Teleview Recommendation for Tv Reception.

The Digital Broadcast Tv stations/channels are Very Weak at your location at 20 feet antenna height.

I suspect that No Digital Tv stations/channels will be reliably received with a Tv antenna inside the building.

1 channel is in the yellow reception zone and is Very Weak.

Then down in to the Red reception zone and the channels are Even Weaker Yet.

The Digital Broadcast Tv stations/channels at , 77 degrees true / 86 degrees magnetic compass direction , look to be all in the UHF TV band of channels 14 thru 51.

Install a Winegard HD7698P antenna with a Antennas Direct CPA-19 preamp aimed at about , 77 degrees true , 86 degree magnetic compass.

Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

For 1 Tv connected use No splitter.

For 2 Tv's connected use a HFS-2D , 2 way splitter.

For 3 Tv's connected use a HFS-3D , 3 way splitter.

Buy the HFS splitters at , http://www.hollandelectronics.com or http://www.solidsignal.com.

Here are places to buy antennas and etc. , http://www.solidsignal.com , http://www.amazon.com , http://www.winegarddirect.com.

The Tv/s Must Channel Scan for the Digital Broadcast Tv Channels , sometimes named the 'Air Channels' or 'Antenna Channels' in the Tv setup menu because the Tv channels are transmitted through the air from the transmitting antenna to the receiving antenna.

DO NOT channel scan for cable tv channels.

As always , trees and tree leaves do a real fine job of , reducing or blocking Tv reception and so do buildings and other obstructions.

It is best to locate the antenna at a location that has the least amount of or no amount of obstructions in the direction of reception and higher antenna placement is usually the best.

Last edited by teleview; 25-Aug-2012 at 8:27 AM.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 6:05 PM   #5
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Tv Reception.

A Teleview Recommendation for Tv Reception.

There are also some receivable Digital Tv stations/channels at about 111 degree true / 120 degree magnetic compass direction.

This group has 1 VHF high band channel , 12 , NBC and MeTv.

So this is the reason for the HD7698P , UHF channels 14 thru 51 / VHF channels 7 thru 13 antenna.

Reception of the this group of Digital Tv stations/channels will be improved by aiming the HD7698P antenna , in between the 2 groups of Tv stations , at about 100 degree magnetic compass direction.

Last edited by teleview; 25-Aug-2012 at 8:28 AM.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 6:09 PM   #6
signals unlimited
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I agree that an all UHF antenna would serve the channels at 77 degrees.

I still recommend the High VHF capability due to the High VHF channels that could be received with rotation. WSET 13 is a major player and may be desirable in the future.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 6:18 PM   #7
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Yes, but the OP needs maximum UHF gain to ensure reliable reception of the C-ville channels. The signal pulling power of the 91-XG is superior to any combo antenna; period.

If the VHF stations are desired later on, I would recommend a separate Antennacraft Y10-7-13, but IMO the VHF stations look too weak to provide reliable reception.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 6:24 PM   #8
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Those VHF signals are unlikely to make it to his location except by reflection or coincidence. WSET has a 1000' tall mountain in the way just across the valley. The PBS station in Staunton is behind a 1500' chunk of rock. It's Charlottesville DTS transmitter is only 40 watts with a north-facing transmitting antenna.

Reception from Charlottesville is going to be hard enough with its mountainous terrain blocking signals. Stick with the highly directional UHF-only antenna with pre-amp. Either get it above the trees or find a gap to "shoot" through for better odds.
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Last edited by ADTech; 23-Aug-2012 at 6:29 PM.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 6:29 PM   #9
teleview
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Tv Reception.

A Teleview Recommandation for Tv Reception.

Here is a list of Digital Tv stations/channels.

The East group at 77 degree true / 86 degree magnetic compass direction.

WVIR-DT REAL Digital UHF channel 32 , virtual number (29.1-2) NBC and The CW and Weather X.

WHTJ REAL Digital UHF channel 46 , virtual number (41.1-2-3) PBS.

WCAV-DT REAL Digital UHF channel 19 ,virtual number (19.1-2) CNS and FOX and Weather X.

WVAW-LD REAL Digital UHF channel 16 , virtual number (16.1) ABC.

WAHU-CD REAL Digital UHF channel 40 , virtual number (27.1-2-3) FOX and MyNetwork and This Tv Network.

_____________

Here is a list of Digital Tv stations channels.

The South east group at 111 degree true / 120 degree magnetic compass direction.

WRIC-DT REAL Digital UHF channel 22 , virtual number (8.1-2) ABC and Live Well Tv Network.

WRLH-DT REAL Digital UHF channel 26 , virtual number (35.1-2-3-4) FOX and MyNetwork and This Tv and The Cool Tv.

WWBT REAL Digital VHF channel 12 , virtual number (12.1-2) NBC and MeTv Network.

WTVR-DT REAL Digital UHF channel 25 , virtual number (6.1-2) CBS and Antenna Tv Network.

Last edited by teleview; 25-Aug-2012 at 8:28 AM.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 6:37 PM   #10
teleview
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Tv Reception.

A Teleview Recommendation for Tv Reception.

I Strongly recommend the HD7698P antenna , it is better to have the HD7698P antenna to receive the UHF and VHF channels that I listed.

Last edited by teleview; 25-Aug-2012 at 8:28 AM.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 6:50 PM   #11
teleview
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Tv Reception.

A Teleview Recommendation for Tv Reception.

And as for ,

WSET-TV REAL Digital VHF channel 13 , virtual number (13.1-2-3) at 225 degree true / 234 degree magnetic compass direction.

The HD7698P antenna can be turned around by hand to ' Test ' reception of WSET to see if the signal will be reliable.

Here is what is on WSET. ABC and RTV Retro Tv Network and Weather Nation Tv Network.

Last edited by teleview; 25-Aug-2012 at 8:29 AM.
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Old 23-Aug-2012, 7:35 PM   #12
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My 2 cents... The OP has already stated, "We're only interested in picking up the signals from the channels at the 77 azimuth." so, the UHF only 91XG is the better choice. If I were in the same spot, I'd use an Antennacraft Y10713 (or a ganged pair: http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=1024) to go after real channels 11, 12 & 13.

The signal levels shown on this report may not call for extreme measures but do call for some additional effort.

Whether to rotate one or both antennas is up to the OP... it depends on what your tastes are and what you can really receive once the antenna is in the air.

I would plan on using a preamplifier on each antenna rather than combining into a single down lead to share a single amplifier. The Antennas Direct PA-18 would be my choice. The outputs of both preamps can be combined into a single lead to feed multiple sets.

Last edited by GroundUrMast; 23-Aug-2012 at 8:43 PM. Reason: Ack. the OP's request
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Old 24-Aug-2012, 4:32 AM   #13
BlueRidgeVA
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Wow. Thanks so much for the wealth of information. I need to digest, and figure out how I can get the mast up on the roof (14:12 pitch). There are tall trees below the house - I'll check on the azimuth tomorrow. Thanks again for all your help so far.
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Old 24-Aug-2012, 7:03 AM   #14
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Tv Reception.

A Teleview Recommendation for Tv Reception.

Here are some above the roof antenna mounts , http://www.ronard.com/909911.html , http://www.ronard.com/34424560.html , http://www.ronard.com/ychim.html , http://www.ronard.com.

Buy the ronard antenna mounts at , http://www.solidsignal.com , by typing the word ronard in the solidsignal search box.

Last edited by teleview; 25-Aug-2012 at 8:29 AM.
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Old 24-Aug-2012, 2:57 PM   #15
BlueRidgeVA
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Trees directly in the path ...

Hello. Thanks again for all of your valuable help. I checked the 77 degree azimuth this morning, and was surprised where I was pointed. I've attached a photo showing my situation. The 77 azimuth passes through the tree just to the right of the chimney. I did not get on the roof to see what the line of site would be, but imagine it is straight through the top section of the tree. It's kind of a cross-slope direction, but the ground is dropping away so more distant trees should not come into play.
Does this look like a 'deal killer' to you?
BTW - the 111 azimuth is more straight downhill, with about the same tree situation.
Another quick question. We use the fireplace a lot in the winter. Any issues with bolting a mast to the side of the chimney?
Thanks again everyone.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg antenna view.jpg (283.2 KB, 266 views)
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Old 24-Aug-2012, 3:54 PM   #16
teleview
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Tv Reception.

A Teleview Recommendation for Tv Reception.

Is not a deal killer. Looks good to me for reception.

They are young trees , not much leaves and young trees are easy to trim the top off.

Mount the antenna so the hot gasses out the top of the chimney do not come come in direct close contact with the plastic parts of the antenna or the connecting metal parts of the antenna.

Avoid mounting over the top of the actual chimney pipe.

The hot gases are corossive and will shorten the life of the antenna.

If possible , mount the antenna over to side away from the chimney pipe and have the antenna about 3 feet above the chimney pipe.

The decarotive slats of the outside of the chimney will most likely not hold the antenna.

Needs to be something substantial behind the slats to bolt in to with these type of mounts , http://www.ronard.com/100204.html.

Also keep the mounts far apart to reduce the twisting and side to side leverage of wind force movement on the , antenna , mounting mast pipe , mounting brackets.

Last edited by teleview; 25-Aug-2012 at 8:30 AM.
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Old 24-Aug-2012, 4:19 PM   #17
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If you want reliable reception year-round, the tree-top will probably have to go. Otherwise, you'll likely encounter reception difficulties particularly during the time of year when the tree is leafed out. It will be worse when the tree is wet and the wind blows.

Is it a deal killer? Some folks still get good reception even through trees while others don't. We recommend trying to avoid the problem whenever possible.

Do keep the antenna away from the smoke. Creosote accumulation will turn acidic when it rains and will cause corrosion to accelerate.
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