Need Help Selecting Antenna

bergerb · 26-Aug-2011, 7:16 PM

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...9e74bf7f082457

Should I purchase a roof top antenna? I would really like to mount one in my attic if possible. I'm trying to get some of the red channels.

What would you recommend?

Thanks!

GroundUrMast · 26-Aug-2011, 11:17 PM

Are you focusing on reception of the Baltimore stations?

What stations are 'must-have's'?

Will you be connecting more than one set?

John Candle · 27-Aug-2011, 9:06 AM

No matter what stations are received , To get all of the network stations a outside roof top antenna will be needed for the north/north east group of to get all of the networks. . And a outside roof top antenna will be needed for all of the network stations for the group of stations to the south east.

John Candle · 27-Aug-2011, 9:07 AM

What I need to know now is how many Tv's are/will be connected?? . You can have York/Harrisburg or Baltimore. Or you can have both York/Harrisburg and Baltimore. The number of Tv's that are/will be connected will decide how much money you will like to spend.

bergerb · 27-Aug-2011, 11:10 AM

Currently I'm pulling in 43, 49, 8 and 15 with an inside antenna.

I would like to also get wbal, an abc channel, and fox 45 wbff. Other than I am good.

I currently have one tv and would like to add another upstairs soon; so two.

I'm flexible with the budget. 150 to 300. I would like a project I could do.

My home is two stories probably 35 to 40 ft at peak.

John Candle · 27-Aug-2011, 12:00 PM

You are naming tv stations that are in the directions of , York/Harrisburg and Baltimore. When selecting Tv stations you will like to receive use the Tv station call sign and the Real digital channel number. Read and understand about , REAL Digital Broadcast Tv Channels , Virtual Digital Broadcast Tv Channels , Analog Broadcast Tv Channels , http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=695 . For the York/Harrisburg network Tv stations/channels the cost will be about 300 dollars , for the Baltimore network Tv stations/channels the cost will be about 300 dollars. GUM suggests 'must haves' but he is not telling you the whole story , if your 'must haves' are tv stations that are York/Harrisburg and Baltimore then you will need 2 Tv antennas , one pointed at York/Harrisburg and one pointed at Baltimore or one antenna and a rotor. A rotor does not work well with 2 or more Tv's because of the conflict with other Tv watchers that will develop over where the Tv antenna is pointed. What he is also not telling you is that if a Tv antenna is pointed at say Baltimore as an example , and you say that you will only like to receive say 4 channels , you Will Receive the other channels in the direction Baltimore because the Tv antenna is pointed at Baltimore. And this same situation is also true if the Tv antenna is pointed at York/Harrisburg. When GUM does this 'must have' 'don't care about' thing it causes a lot of , confusion , frustration , disapointment and even anger. . You can install one Tv antenna and Tv antenna mount and Tv antenna amplifier and coax now and point the antenna at York/Harrisburg or Baltimore. What will you choose for now?? So I can recommend the correct Tv antenna and ect.. . You can ad a second antenna later pointed in the other direction.

John Candle · 27-Aug-2011, 12:06 PM

And Yes with my detailed Easy To Understand instructions you will do it your self. The antennas no matter what direction they are aimed will be roof mounted.

GroundUrMast · 27-Aug-2011, 4:57 PM

The weak signal from WBAL and WBFF call for a roof mounted antenna such as a Winegard HD7696P. I expect that you will need an amplifier to overcome splitter and cable loss. Consider the Antennas Direct CPA-19 or the Winegard HDP-269. Aimed at 163°, that antenna and others like it (directional & moderate to high gain) will not reliably receive the group of stations NE of you. (But you may get lucky.)

Keep the current indoor antenna (possibly in the attic). Keep the two antenna systems separate, up to an A/B switch at each TV to select the desired antenna.

John Candle · 27-Aug-2011, 8:46 PM

Gum is still not giving you all the information.

bergerb · 29-Aug-2011, 1:19 PM

To simplify one TV setup is fine for now.

Instead of using two antennas could one antenna with a rotor be setup? Then with a box that when I change the channel it would rotate the antenna by itself? Or even something I could rotate by myself?

I'm guessing no omni directional antenna exists that could pull some NE and S?

Can two antennas be spliced together to pull it into one line without an A/B switch? Or is that impossible?

GroundUrMast · 29-Aug-2011, 3:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bergerb

To simplify one TV setup is fine for now.

Instead of using two antennas could one antenna with a rotor be setup? Then with a box that when I change the channel it would rotate the antenna by itself? Or even something I could rotate by myself?

I'm guessing no omni directional antenna exists that could pull some NE and S?

Can two antennas be spliced together to pull it into one line without an A/B switch? Or is that impossible?

A rotator is a valid option. When adding a second TV, some folks have opted to install a second antenna dedicated to the second TV. When there are stations scattered around the compass, this is one of several options. Look into the CM-7000 set-top-converter... it's getting a bit hard to find but it was one of the few STB's that integrated rotator control. (When I checked the link, Channel Master indicated that the unit is out of stock. If you can find one for sale, it integrates with the CM9521 rotator.)

The Channel Master CM9521 rotator & remote is a complete option by itself.

You can try an omni... but I expect you will be disappointed with the results. The signals in the red section of your report would be unreliable if received at all.

Combining two or more directional antennas almost always yields results similar or worse to that of the omni. Exceptions to this are the result of blind luck or excellent professional engineering backed by skilled installation, measurement and tuning using commercial grade parts and test equipment. (A cable TV head-end for example.)

A premium setup using a rotator would be a roof mounted Winegard HD7698P antenna, an Antennas Direct CPA-19 preamp and a rotator.

John Candle · 29-Aug-2011, 5:57 PM

The antenna I recommend is the Winegard HD7698P antenna with a Channel Master CM 9521A remote control rotor. The rotor and rotor control box comes with a hand held wireless remote control. The antenna and rotor will be roof mounted. Here are some mounts , http://www.ronard.com/909911.html , http://www.ronard.com/34424560.html , http://www.ronard.com/engineered-rot...ount-3324.html. Here is how to aim Tv antennas , http://kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html . Here are places to buy antennas and etc. , http://www.solidsignal.com , http://www.starkelectronic.com , http://www.amazon.com , http://www.3starinc.com

John Candle · 29-Aug-2011, 6:17 PM

If a converter is needed , here are converters , http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=380

John Candle · 29-Aug-2011, 6:21 PM

read and understand about , REAL Digital Broadcast Tv Channels , Virtual Digital Broadcast Tv Channels , Analog Broadcast Tv Channels , http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=695

bergerb · 29-Aug-2011, 6:37 PM

Real is what the actual number (frequency) and virtual is what it has been re-branded to.

Anyway you look at it a channel is a channel.

All my channels are in the VHF hi. So an antenna optimized for channels 7-69 is needed.

~

I did notice that they TV Signal Analysis on here did not include other channels.

Say Real 47 re-branded to 43.1.. I also get 43.2 and 43.3 though it is not mentioned anywhere. Same goes for most of them.

John Candle · 29-Aug-2011, 6:40 PM

Yes antennas can be spliced , But NOT in your situation. If VHF stations are located in one direction and UHF stations are located in a other direction then a UVSJ can be used to combine the two antennas. This NOT Your Situation. And because you are thinking of ways to wiggle around , I will state it again , THIS NOT YOUR SITUATION. Other then this situation I have just described , GUM is correct , combining multipul and different Tv channels of multipul geographic locations on to one coax requires thousands up on thousands of dollars of electronic equipment. Or for a home reception situation a rotor can be used.

John Candle · 29-Aug-2011, 6:59 PM

I still recommend the 2 antenna solution. With the 2 antennas installed and the coax wiring installed. A hand held remote controled A/B antenna switch , model ab27rs or a radio shack 15-1968 is used to switch from one antenna to the other. No waiting for the antenna to rotate around. And with the A/B antenna switch set up , a second or third Tv can be added and each Tv will have a A/B antenna switch to watch what ever they like. You can do the antenna and rotor now , and do the second antenna thing later. So now you say what do I do with the rotor ?? I won't need it when a second antenna is installed?? My answer , leave it in place or sell it in the garage sale.

John Candle · 29-Aug-2011, 7:11 PM

Digital Tv channels can also transmit digital sub channels. To keep Clutter reduced , all the digital sub channels are Not listed. If you will like to find out what all the digital sub channels are you can do it this way , in the google search box type in as a example , wmur tv . Also you have receivable Tv channels in two Tv bands , VHF channels 7 thru 13 and UHF channels 14 thru 69. I am telling you the real and actual truth.

GroundUrMast · 29-Aug-2011, 9:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bergerb

...
Anyway you look at it a channel is a channel.

All my channels are in the VHF hi. So an antenna optimized for channels 7-69 is needed.

~
...

I have to respectfully disagree. There is a clear distinction between real and virtual channels.

Example - If you tell me that you would like to receive "WHTM, real channel 10", I know that that will require an antenna with high-band-VHF capability. It is also quite clear which signal on your TVFR is referenced, making it easy to be sure I am looking at the correct information for the signal you are interested in. Antenna selection is not influenced by the number of virtual channels carried in that real channel nor by the designation numbers of the virtual channels.

If you tell me you want to receive "channel 49" , there is the potential for ambiguity or confusion. Simply referring to "channel 49" leaves it to the reader to guess what you are referring to. If I were to find a real channel 49 (WGAL low in the red section on your TVFR) and a virtual channel 49.1 (WGCB real CH-30) listed, I'd not be able to understand what channel you were referring too.

If you spoke of "channel 49.1", I'd be confident you are referring to a virtual channel, but I'll need to look up the real channel number to know what type antenna is needed.

The majority of the channels available to you are not high-band-VHF (real channels 7 through 13). They are UHF (real channels 14 and up).

Cheers

John Candle · 29-Aug-2011, 9:39 PM

WMAR-TV 38 is REAL UHF channel 38. That is the real and actual channel that is transmitted and received. The real channels that the antenna and tuner receive are 38.1 , 38.2 and ect. . The Virtual channels are 2.1 and 2.2 and ect. . You or any one else need to know the real channels so as to know the Correct antenna to use. Virtual channels are in fact --> virtual , even if the real channel is 38.1 and the virtual channel is 38.1 the virtual channel number is still the virtual channel number. And real channel number is still the real channel number. As a example of Real , virtual , analog. Lets say that you have been watching analog channel 2 ABC for the past 20 years. You expect to see ABC 2 on the Tv screen. This known as Brand Identifaction. When the Tv station changed from analog to digital transmission , You or others Still expect to see ABC 2 , so the Tv station keeps the number 2 because thats what you expect to see and you feel safe and happy with the number 2 because that is what you think of , for/with , ABC , you have been watching ABC 2 for the past 20 years. However when the the Tv station went to digital the real and actual channel is UHF 38. I am telling you the real and actual truth.