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Old 31-Aug-2019, 1:46 PM   #1
olnick
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trying again to get ch 31 real 25.1 virtual (fox)

back in 2016 I tried unsuccessfully to cut the cord.. My only hold back is that I watch fox 25 (boston) news and was not able to get even a whisper of a signal.
I have an RCA ant3036X antenna. Aimed 161 deg mag.
I am now looking to use #1 a Kosmic Super Quad tuned to ch 31? #2 a Super Stealth Hawk? or #3 a Gray- Hoverman7?

Using the current ant I get more than enough other channels to view, my main concern is real ch 31 fox 25.1. Ch 9&11 come in perfect off the side.

Of the three options what would provide the best overall tunability to adjust for max gain at that freq? If this can be tuned to the peak of the waveform either side should still provide adequate gain to pull in the other channels as well.

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Old 31-Aug-2019, 3:56 PM   #2
Tower Guy
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Since you last tried WFXT has moved from channel 31 to channel 34. I believe that they also moved to another tower.
This link has your updated info:
https://www.rabbitears.info/searchma...&study_id=7251

I’d try again with your existing antenna.

I don’t remember if you have a preamp and if so, which model.
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Old 31-Aug-2019, 4:01 PM   #3
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One additional caveat is that there is a transmitting antenna issue effecting several of the Boston UHF stations. I’d try rescanning multiple times over a several week period before I considered another antenna.

Last edited by Tower Guy; 31-Aug-2019 at 4:05 PM.
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Old 31-Aug-2019, 4:35 PM   #4
olnick
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I,m using an RCA tvpramp1 amplifier. "UP DATE" this was my old one!! after checking out the cellar connections I see a CM-3412 amp now in place and the rca tvpramp1 has no wires connected to it

olnick

Last edited by olnick; 31-Aug-2019 at 10:30 PM.
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Old 31-Aug-2019, 5:28 PM   #5
ADTech
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As TG mentioned, numerous Boston stations are operating at reduced power, some from temporary facilities. Until they are all up and running at full capability over the coming weeks and, perhaps months, you may end up chasing ghosts that cannot be caught.


WFXT has filed their paperwork that their post-repack facility is complete so do give a re-scan a try and see what happens. Just be aware that they may be running from their auxiliary facility so coverage may still be reduced fro full capability. You might want to follow the local chatter in the Boston section over at AVSForum as a couple of the guys have been providing updates.
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Last edited by ADTech; 31-Aug-2019 at 5:31 PM.
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Old 1-Sep-2019, 8:17 PM   #6
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Update! Just using the CM3412 distribution amp:
2 nd floor 5 ch and 14 virtual ch's
1 st floor 6 ch and 19 virtual ch's

With the RCA TVpramp1 installed and powered up along with the CM 3412:

2 nd floor 7 ch and 28 virtual ch's
1 st floor 7 ch and 23 virtual ch's CH #s 5 9 11 27 29 32 42

Still NO Ch34/ 25.1 wfxt neither set will allow manual entry of CH34!

Olnick

Last edited by olnick; 1-Sep-2019 at 9:27 PM.
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Old 1-Sep-2019, 9:09 PM   #7
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Based on an estimate of your location, you're likely not going to get that station right now. Until everything is fully operational on their permanent full powered facility on the other end, you're probably just spinning your wheels with no prospect of gaining any traction. The Cabot Street tower location doesn't appear to provide any predicted signal to your location.


Lower transmitter power, a shorter tower, and a directional side-mounted antenna that does not favor your azimuth are all contributing factors.
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Last edited by ADTech; 1-Sep-2019 at 9:31 PM.
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Old 2-Sep-2019, 10:27 PM   #8
olnick
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WOW what a mess!!
https://www.concordmonitor.com/TV-ch...nging-27376831

I went to the FCC site and I get the other two ch's that are shown as no signal!! so there is hope 34 (25.1) will be in the line up soon???????

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Old 3-Sep-2019, 11:11 PM   #9
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https://www.rabbitears.info/searchma...&study_id=7774

Quote:
Originally Posted by olnick View Post
WOW what a mess!!
https://www.concordmonitor.com/TV-ch...nging-27376831

I went to the FCC site and I get the other two ch's that are shown as no signal!! so there is hope 34 (25.1) will be in the line up soon???????
Yeah, Repack is a mess and the cellular companies got the spectrum they wanted.

Right now WFXT 34 is probably using their CBS Tower transmitter:



When they switch to their regular Cabot St transmitter, your chances should improve:



But, you will still have your old problems like the WFXT coverage is spotty in your area. Red is the weakest listed signal strength; no color is weaker:



and there is a hill in the signal path just before your location:







And the TREES surrounding your house that block TV signals.
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File Type: jpg olnickTVFcovWFXT34.JPG (221.2 KB, 704 views)
File Type: jpg olnickTVFp3WFXT34.JPG (66.3 KB, 702 views)
File Type: jpg olnickTVFp2WFXT34.JPG (110.6 KB, 720 views)
File Type: jpg olnickTVFpathWFXT2.JPG (98.4 KB, 733 views)
File Type: jpg olnickTVFreportRE2.jpg (213.4 KB, 713 views)
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Last edited by rabbit73; 4-Sep-2019 at 5:38 PM.
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Old 4-Sep-2019, 12:50 AM   #10
olnick
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Thank you rabbit73! You did give me all the details I needed!
I am amazed that I get 24.1 as it is in the same catagory as 25.1 "bad" signal!! I can swing the ant approx 10 deg mag. either side of 161 deg mag and still get 24.1? If they are coming from the same tower I should be able to get 25.1 when the dust finally settles. (I hope).
That is the point when the cord gets cut once and for all!!!

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Old 4-Sep-2019, 1:46 PM   #11
rabbit73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by olnick View Post
I am amazed that I get 24.1 as it is in the same catagory as 25.1 "bad" signal!! I can swing the ant approx 10 deg mag. either side of 161 deg mag and still get 24.1? If they are coming from the same tower I should be able to get 25.1 when the dust finally settles. (I hope).
24.1 is WFXZ on VHF-Low real channel 5. It is a Guest on the WGBH transmitter and not transmitting on its own:
https://www.rabbitears.info/market.p...=64833#station

If you look at the Boston Repack plan, you will see that WFXZ sold their license in the Repack reverse auction.
https://www.rabbitears.info/repackch...=&lss=&status=

WGBH is the Host:
https://www.rabbitears.info/market.p...n=WGBH#station

WGBH is now using Circular Polarization with 6.7 kW Horizontal and 6.7 kW Vertical ERP.
https://www.rabbitears.info/tvq.php?...ms&facid=72099

WGBH would be listed higher up, but a correction factor has been subtracted from the Field Strength to allow for the higher noise level on VHF-Low. Notice that its Signal Margin is 10.34 dB as a result, which is out of order.

VHF-Low signals can make it over hills better than UHF signals. So, even though they will be on the same tower, they will be on different TV bands.

If you are still not able to get WFXT after Repack, the only thing that I can think of to try is a WFXT dedicated UHF antenna like the Antennas Direct 91XG or Solid Signal HDB91X mounted above the trees with the front end tilted up to possibly catch the signal coming down from the peak of the hill.

I wish you good luck.
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Last edited by rabbit73; 4-Sep-2019 at 2:19 PM.
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Old 4-Sep-2019, 6:01 PM   #12
Tower Guy
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Tilting an antenna upwards may gain about a db. Theoretically, installing an antenna at the optimum height can gain as much as 6 dB. If the antenna happens to be at the worst height where it is now, the gain due to finding the best height could be as much as 20 dB.

Rather than tilting an antenna upwards toward the top of the hill, I’d suggest raising or lowering the antenna to find the sweet spot.
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Old 4-Sep-2019, 8:15 PM   #13
rabbit73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tower Guy View Post
Rather than tilting an antenna upwards toward the top of the hill, I’d suggest raising or lowering the antenna to find the sweet spot.
Trying different heights is an excellent idea because of layering, but my main concern is with the trees that surround his house.
http://forum.tvfool.com/showpost.php...7&postcount=22







As far as tilting is concerned, I recall one case where it made a difference between no reception and good reception for a location behind a hill. I think it's worth a try, especially as a act of desperation. The tilt feature already comes with the antennas I suggested; what's the harm in testing the theory?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Signal Layering2.jpg (48.6 KB, 611 views)
File Type: jpg olnickTVFtrees1442 _1.jpg (215.1 KB, 606 views)
File Type: jpg olnickTVFtrees1444 _1.jpg (278.5 KB, 584 views)
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Last edited by rabbit73; 5-Sep-2019 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 22-Jan-2020, 1:10 PM   #14
olnick
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Talking Major progress!

My last posting I was attempting to get ch 34 (25-1) Boston fox news. The channel listing I had: 5,9,11,27,29,32,42 this provided 18 options to watch.
during the first cold snap we had with single digit temps, I did another scan,
now I get: 5,9,12,20,22,23,27,28,29,32,33,34,39,42,50 this line up provides 57 options to watch. Most come in at 100% a few get pixelated and it seems that as the temp increases (and the sun gets higher in the horizon) the number of channels drops off. Not back to the original 7 but I do loose 4-5 and others pixelate.
Now that I can receive these channels are there any options to allow me to keep them? any other amps etc.?

The hard woods have dropped their leafs as well!

Thanks

Olnick
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Old 22-Jan-2020, 1:20 PM   #15
rickbb
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Try replacing your balun.

When the only thing that changes is the temp it could be the balun housing is expanding and making the connections lose. Or some other internal component is getting weaker due to the expansion.

It could also be any of the other connections or components experiencing issues with temp contraction/expansion.
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Old 22-Jan-2020, 5:49 PM   #16
olnick
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Thanks I never would have given the balun a second guess that it would cause problems, Just need the snow to melt off the roof prior to me changing it!!

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Old 16-Feb-2020, 3:52 PM   #17
olnick
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Still have not replaced the Balun! when the roof was clear it was too windy with 20 MPH gusts to be up there. I no longer need a thermometer to know the outside temp!! It is very accurate to how many channels I get!!! This got me thinking The current preamp?? is an RCA -TVPRAMP1 that might be getting temperature sensitive? guessing 7-8 years old? are there any better preamps out there now?? This will save me another trip up onto the roof...

Thanks

Olnick
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Old 17-Feb-2020, 12:53 AM   #18
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The Antennas Direct 'Juice' preamp is working well for me. It has not shown any signs of overload despite the rather strong levels of many of the signals. (I'm driving relatively long runs of coax and splitting at least eight ways.)
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Old 11-Mar-2020, 9:03 PM   #19
olnick
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Just got off the roof, finished changing out The Balun. Since the temps have moderated into the 50-60'S during the day, I once again only get 5 channels. There was NO change with the balun replacement. I also noticed a bad "F" connector on the down feed and replaced that as well! Might be time to replace the RCA pre amp as a just to be sure its good?

Tower Guy mentioned lowering the antenna to find the "sweet spot" what is the distance between the layers? Am I looking at 6 inches or 3 feet to find the "sweet" spot? It might be easier to go up 6-8 inches with a re location of my chimney mounts rather than going down 20-25 inches!

Thanks

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Old 11-Mar-2020, 10:33 PM   #20
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Quote:
Am I looking at 6 inches or 3 feet to find the "sweet" spot?
According to hdtvprimer.com and posted in another thread by rabbit73 similar to #13 above:

"For UHF the strong and weak spots are often 5 to 20 feet apart. If you are in a neighborhood with overlapping fields, moving your antenna a few feet can make a huge difference in signal strength. The chimney might seem like the perfect site, but if the chimney is in a weak spot then the chimney is a mistake. To make matters worse, the pattern of strong and weak spots will be different for different frequencies."

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/siting.html

If I can find rabbit73's post of Signal Layering/Overlapping Fields I'll edit with link or perhaps he will chime in with it.

Hope this helps.....

Last edited by OTAFAN; 11-Mar-2020 at 10:42 PM. Reason: additional
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