Help with Reception - Hannibal, MO

[ihwf_vp]

Hello All-

I'm new to TV Fool and was looking for some help on a project. I live in Hannibal, MO which is 19 miles from transmitters in Quincy IL, and roughly 95 miles from transmitters in St Louis, MO. I can pick up the channels in Quincy with no problem and currently do on a small antenna at about 20 ft in height. I've been working on a project to try to pick up St Louis locals since that is the market in which I am originally from (and prefer).

For a little background, I have provided the link from the tv fool tool.. TV Fool. As far as my system, I am running a 1byone branded 100 mile range with power supply digital antenna.. Part number is OUS00-0549 from my roof about 25 ft off of the ground. I also have this plugged into a Radio Shack bi directional amplifier(item number 15-205) that I had laying around to try to overcome and cable loss I had.

I just installed this antenna on Saturday and right away I picked up 34 channels. I was able to receive in KTVI Channel 2, KMOV Channel 4, KSDK Channel 5, KETC Channel 9, KPLR Channel 11, KNLC Channel 24, and KDNL Channel 30.. Among other randoms. Those are the main stations though in St Louis. I'm not saying all 34 channels showed up with picture but it at least saw the channel and left a blank placeholder on a few of the lower powered ones. I initially watched channel 5 for about 5 minutes with no pixelation issues and then left the house. After I got back, only channel 4 would come in and nothing else. Later in the day, I got to where 4 was barely coming in as well. Since then, there has been good times where I've watched a few channels with no pixelation for a few minutes but for the most part, it is either not coming in, or pixelating too bad that its unwatchable.

I know that I am fighting some major distance and that is likely my main obstacle. I honestly didn't think that I would actually pick the channels up at all but now that I have at least seem them, its turned into a game for me to see if I can actually make it work. I've tried repointing but i'm perfectly set at 143 degrees. I've moved it some to 120 to 160 degrees just to see if it would make a difference but nothing yet. I've also messed with the elevation of the antenna a little.. Pointing it straight.. Pointing it with a slight angle up.. And a slight angle down. I've also tried a few other tvs in my house to rule out a crappy tuner but doesn't seem to be much of a difference from tv to tv. I've also had rainy days and clear days but hasn't really seemed to make much of a difference either.

If anyone has any tips or pointers to try, I'd love to hear. I'd be thrilled if I could make it work but I'm not holding my breath.

Thanks in advance.

[rabbit73]

Welcome to the forum, ihwf_vp:

Those signals are listed as Tropo, which means they will never be reliable because they depend upon atmospheric conditions that are favorable for tropospheric propagation.
https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q...ic+propagation

http://www.dxinfocentre.com/tropo_eur.html

http://www.dxinfocentre.com/propagation/tr-modes.htm

I think you are doing very well. Enjoy them while they are coming in. They will continue during the summer, and then be less frequent later in the year.

Theory says that you can not receive signals that have a Noise Margin of less than -15 dB because that is the Thermal Noise Floor. Obviously, you are receiving them because they are coming in stronger than listed because of tropospheric ducting.

It is possible for you to hunt for an antenna with a little more gain, and maybe a preamp with a slightly lower noise figure, but I doubt that it will make much difference. You will still be at the mercy of atmospheric conditions.

Yes, distance is a factor, but so is the curvature of the earth which blocks the signals. If you click on the KTVI callsign in your report you will see the terrain profile. The black arc at the bottom of the profile is the curvature of the earth. The transmitter is on the left and your location ls on the right.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...ALLTV%26n%3d24

If you do experiment with other equipment, you need to know that you have a very strong FM transmitter only 2 miles away that might interfere with TV reception.

http://www.fmfool.com/modeling/tmp/9...b/Radar-FM.png

[ADTech]

We had a cool front move through here late Friday and, consequently, Saturday was cooler and drier in its aftermath than we'd expect for mid July in St Louis. Often, the 24 hours (or so) after the passage of a cold front will allow signals from the deepest fringe to come in temporarily until the atmosphere returns to it's more typical conditions. Sometimes, you'll also see similar effects when a warm front moves up from the south.

[ihwf_vp]

Thank you so much for the info.

I was wondering how much FM interference may have to do with it. I knew about that tower and even though it was in the opposite direction, I still wondered if it was having any negative effect on my reception. I saw there was a preamp with FM trap available on amazon.. RCA TVPRAMP1R Preamplifier. I was considering swapping out my bi directional amp for this and seeing if there was an change in signal with it being a true pre amp.. And with the included fm trap. Would take couple days to get in from Amazon so I could run an experiment on it by the end of the week if it might be worth my time.

I have noticed too that there have been times that its been better and worse. Sunday morning for instance, most channels played great until about 9 am. Seems that earlier in the day the signal is better than signals as the day progresses.

Great info so far though.. Thanks guys!

[rabbit73]

Maybe not to worry since KGRC-FM is in the opposite direction when you get Fox KTVI.

[ihwf_vp]

As an update, I tried a few different amplifiers and I could get the signal up to a better level, nut the noise floor rose right with it. No matter what combination I tried, I always seemed to still have an SNR level around 22. If anything, I've found that going no amp at all has actually provided a little bit better quality of signal than going with an amp.

As most of you are aware, it does appear that I'm just in a Tropo zone with this. When conditions are favorable, I've had really good luck. When conditions aren't, I've seen a loss in signal and sometimes to none at all.

Are there any particular antennas that anyone is having good luck with in picking up Tropo signals from long range of around 100 miles?

[GroundUrMast]

Your experience is yet another confirmation that antenna location is one of the most important factors governing reliable reception. An antenna located in an area that has no usable signal to receive can't provide usable results.

Reception of TV signals from locations far away (over the horizon) depends on atmospheric conditions. When the signal bounces of layers of the atmosphere the right way, you get some usable signal at your location... But the rest of the time, there's no signal in the air and no antenna will solve that problem.

For the best chance at receiving weak signals (DXing) consider large antennas such as the Antennas Direct DB8e, 91XG, or similar form factors from vendors like Channel Master and Winegard. Large all channel antennas such as the Winegard HD8200u are also useful and should be considered.