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Old 31-Aug-2016, 2:51 PM   #1
duplica8
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Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 8
Help please with my location

I had an eight bay antenna mounted approximately 40 feet.
It has a pre-amp then 40 foot line feed to a powered line inserter.
From the line inserter it goes to the splitter that supplies 3 Tv's.
These are the channels I get
5.1 Intermittent
6.1 HD
6.2 SD
11.1 Intermittent
13.1
28.1
31.1
35.1 Intermittent
36.1 Intermittent

How can I improve?
Add another antenna or change the one I have for a different one with greater distance and range.
This is my location

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...e2cb7f4f36ea8b

Thanks in advance.
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Old 31-Aug-2016, 3:03 PM   #2
rabbit73
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Location: S.E. VA
Posts: 2,649
Welcome to the forum, duplica8:

What 8-bay antenna are you using and what direction is it aimed?

What preamp are you using?

Quote:
These are the channels I get
5.1 Intermittent
6.1 HD
6.2 SD
11.1 Intermittent
13.1
28.1
31.1
35.1 Intermittent
36.1 Intermittent
Some of those I don't see listed on your report. What are the callsigns and real, not virtual, channel numbers?



You have channels in different directions. What channels are most important to you?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg duplica8TVF map.JPG (65.2 KB, 748 views)
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Last edited by rabbit73; 31-Aug-2016 at 5:46 PM.
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Old 1-Sep-2016, 9:11 PM   #3
duplica8
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Posts: 8
4 bays pointing west
4 bays pointing SE

Pre-amp
Focus Antennas Adjustable Gain Hamza Tv Antenna Amplifier with Built-In LTE Filter UHF/VHF/FM - HAMZA LTE-2

Max local and US channels if possible
All bays were pointing towards to Toronto but channels were limited so we had them aimed how they are now receiving the list above.

Not sure the antenna model.
5.1 CBLT DT CBC
6.1 CIII HD
6.2 CIII DT
11.1 CHCH DT
13.1 CKCO TV CTV
28.1 CICO DT TVO
31.1 CITY DT -2
35.1 CHCJ
36.1 CITS DT
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Old 2-Sep-2016, 1:56 AM   #4
rabbit73
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Location: S.E. VA
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Thank you for the callsigns.

5.1 Intermittent
CBLT-DT CBC listed under Pending on report as real 20, virtual 20.1; actually real 20, virtual 5.1
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CBLT-DT
NM 10.2 dB, 2Edge, 47.6 mi, 73 deg true

Is that the escarpment in the path of your signal?



Quote:
Pre-amp
Focus Antennas Adjustable Gain Hamza Tv Antenna Amplifier with Built-In LTE Filter UHF/VHF/FM - HAMZA LTE-2
Quote:
Adjustable gain (18 dB / 30 dB)
Gain: VHF 30 dB - UHF 30 dB
What gain setting are you using?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg duplica8TVFp2CBLT.JPG (100.3 KB, 716 views)
__________________
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Last edited by rabbit73; 2-Sep-2016 at 2:10 AM.
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Old 2-Sep-2016, 2:45 AM   #5
duplica8
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There is an escarpment towards Toronto.
I think that is why the channels were blocked and the tech re aimed the antenna.
Not sure what the gain is set at.
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Old 2-Sep-2016, 6:23 PM   #6
rabbit73
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Quote:
How can I improve?
Add another antenna or change the one I have for a different one with greater distance and range.
You have a difficult location for TV reception because the channels you want are in 3 different directions. The 4-bay section aimed west seems to be doing OK. The 4-bay section aimed SE isn't doing very well because there is an escarpment in that direction too, and the SE aim is wrong for CBLT in Toronto.

35.1 Intermittent
CHCJ CTV Two real 35, virtual 35.1
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CKVR-DT
NM 12.7 dB, 2Edge, 26.4 mi, 124 deg t[rue



If your preamp gain is set for 30 dB, there is a good chance that the tuner is overloaded by CIII-DT with a signal power of -36.6 dBm, which will make the weaker channels more difficult to receive.

-36.6 dBm + 12 dB ant gain + 30 dB preamp = +5.4 dBm

Attached Images
File Type: jpg duplica8TVFp2CHCJ.JPG (94.9 KB, 732 views)
File Type: jpg Focus Preamp2.jpg (112.7 KB, 722 views)
__________________
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Last edited by rabbit73; 2-Sep-2016 at 7:31 PM.
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Old 2-Sep-2016, 8:14 PM   #7
rabbit73
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Quote:
I had an eight bay antenna mounted approximately 40 feet.
Not sure the antenna model.
4 bays pointing west
4 bays pointing SE
The 8-bay antenna that allows you to aim each panel in a different direction sounds good in the advertising description, but it doesn't always work. The problem is that when the same signals from each section arrive at the combiner, they will interfere with each other if they don't arrive in phase (at the same instant). If you don't get the same channels when combined that you got when you tried with both panels aimed in the same direction at each different azimuth, then it doesn't work at your location.

ADTech, who works for Antennas Direct (they make the DB8e), and gives good advice here, says that it has the best chance of working when the panels are at right angles (90 degrees).
__________________
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Last edited by rabbit73; 2-Sep-2016 at 8:18 PM.
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Old 2-Sep-2016, 10:33 PM   #8
rabbit73
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Location: S.E. VA
Posts: 2,649
Quote:
How can I improve?
I'm not sure. The best setup for reception would be a separate antenna and preamp for each direction, but you probably wouldn't want to do that because it would be very inconvenient with 3 TVs; it would need switches and rescanning.

I can suggest some tests you can make to see if it is even possible to get good reception from 73 and 122 degrees true. Try aiming both panels at 83 degrees magnetic and see what you get from Toronto. Then try aiming both panels SE at 132 degrees magnetic to see if the escarpment is no longer a problem.

If you then get good reception from both of those problem directions, you will need to decide which channels are most important to you and how much trouble and expense you are willing to do.

Possible solutions:

1. Just one direction, and be happy with that.
2. One antenna and a rotator. That would mean rescanning when you change directions unless your TVs can add a channel after scan like a Sony, and all 3 TVs would be required to receive only that direction. Also, you wouldn't want to repair the rotator in January, and you wouldn't like to wait for the rotator to change direction.
3. Two directions with 2 antennas aimed directly at the transmitters. That would need an A/B switch for each TV, and you would need to rescan unless the TV can add a channel after scan.
4. Two or three antennas. Antenna A would go to the antenna input of the TV and antenna B and C would go to separate tuners with their output going to the aux input of the TV.
5. Two or three antennas combined into one coax with custom combiners from Tin Lee Electronics (expensive) or from Jan Jenca (much less expensive).

http://www.tinlee.com/index.php
http://www.tinlee.com/PDF/AC7-custom...kup%20Info.pdf





6. SiliconDust HDHR tuners combined in a network if you like computers:
An Alternative to Rotators and Antenna Combiners
http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=820

Quote:
Max local and US channels if possible
Not too much chance for US channels; maybe WNLO+WNYB and WNED PBS on a very good day.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg antenna combinerby jan_jenca 2_1.jpg (55.2 KB, 668 views)
File Type: jpg Antenna Combiner4_1.jpg (79.9 KB, 665 views)
__________________
If you can not measure it, you can not improve it.
Lord Kelvin, 1883
http://www.megalithia.com/elect/aeri...ttpoorman.html

Last edited by rabbit73; 2-Sep-2016 at 11:39 PM.
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Old 3-Sep-2016, 10:44 AM   #9
duplica8
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Thanks for all the info.
I will try pointing panels in the suggested directions.
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