Looking for advice with weak signals

nmh5028 · 16-Feb-2013, 4:06 PM

Hello, everyone. This is my first post aftger struggling with this on my own for about a week.

My TV Fool report is here:

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...1dda08fecf8f6e

My goal is to have ABC, CBS, NBC, and FOX (preferrably from the DC market, 323 deg on my TV fool). I don't care much about the other stations. I am limited to an attic install (wife's decision), and I'm using 2 XG91's in a vertical stack, an RCA TVPRAMP1R preamp, a CM3414 amplified distributor to run to 4 TV's in the house.

Here is a general idea of the wiring setup:

2x XG91 ---- splitter/combiner ---- preamp ---- CM3414 ---- 1 TV on direct feed (15 ft), 3 others after a ~25ft run and 3 way splitter and 10-25 ft feeds.

I am getting WMDT (ABC) and WBOC (CBS) from the east with my antennas pointed at 325 deg, so the VHF stations in DC are not a concern at the moment.

The real question here is this... I am gettingWTTG (FOX) and WRC-HD (NBC) just fine with only one TV turned on. A channel scan on any individual TV turns up 31 digital channels. As soon as I turn on any other TV in the house, that number drops to 15/16 depending on the TV, and WRC-HD and WTTG drop from all of the TV's. Turning them back off fixes the issue. I can't see why this would be happening, and I don't think more amplification seems like a good idea. Any suggestions?

No static at all · 16-Feb-2013, 5:05 PM

How long is the cable run from the antenna to the 3414? Have you ever tried eliminating the RCA pre-amp? We are using a CM7777 preamp & 3414 at my friends house near Charlottesville with similar signal strengths & decent results on all TV's (except the Emerson).

Can't explain why turning on a TV inhibits reception????? What brands of TV's are you using?

nmh5028 · 16-Feb-2013, 5:11 PM

The cable run from the antennas to the RCA Preamp are each 3 ft. The cable from the preamp to the 3414 is 20 feet.

3 of the TVs are identical Samsung LCDs, and the 4th is a Panasonic.

I have not tried eliminating the preamp with the current setup. I will try that later today.

No static at all · 16-Feb-2013, 5:57 PM

While I don't generally like using 2 amps, there are some cases where it can be of benefit. It's a good idea to try them separately first & note any improvement or degradation that occurs.

nmh5028 · 16-Feb-2013, 6:50 PM

Test results after trying different setups with the amps:

No preamp + no CM3414 = no signal except for the very close local channel.

CM3414 only = No signal on WRC or WTTG

RCA Preamp only = Signal on WRC and WTTG, but frequent drops (this was connected directly to the TV with no splitters

RCA preamp + CM3414 = Watchable signal on WRC, good signal on WTTG (with only 1 TV on). Turning other TVs on drops the signal to the point where it is unwatchable or completely gone. This is very consistent... as soon as I hit the power button on the 2nd TV my screen goes black on the 1st TV.

Additional info: All unused ports on the CM3414 are terminated with 75 ohm caps. The wiring after the CM3414 is the coax that was installed in the house when it was built (2006)

No static at all · 16-Feb-2013, 7:22 PM

Hmm, very strange?? Never heard of this. I guess any 2 TV's on at the same time make this occur? Maybe others here have seen this before?

On a different note, how are the other UHF's from DC at your location? I have found ION 66 to always be the strongest channel in the west fringes. CW 50 is surprisingly the worst, even with the maximum 1 million watt signal.

nmh5028 · 16-Feb-2013, 7:45 PM

The signal drop is different depending on which TVs are on. One of the Samsungs is the master bedroom, and is the one that is connected directly to the CM3414. The other Samsungs are in the 2nd and 3rd bedroom, and the Panasonic is in the family room. These are all coming from one output of the CM3414, to a 3 way splitter (a DirecTV leftover).

If I have the Master BR Samsung and the Family room Panasonic on, the signal is tolerable (Drops sound every few minutes but picture is fine). If I turn on either of the other BR Samsungs, the whole thing goes away. Individually, each Samsung TV is fine, but either the 2nd or 3rd bedroom with any other TV kills the whole signal. These TVs are also the closest to the antenna, being pretty close to directly under the spot in the attic where the antennas are.

Any individual TV gets a perfect signal on both WRC and WTTG. (those are the weakest channels, and the only ones that I tested since I don't care much about the others)

To answer your other question, CW 50 has been coming in fine all week. Before I got my 2nd XG91, it was very dependent on the weather. I can't seem to lose ION 66 no matter which way I turn my antenna.

This may all stop being a problem when I get my VHF antenna. I have a Y10-7-13 on the way which I'm hoping will be able to pick up WJLA and WUSA from DC, along with WBFF and WBAL from Baltimore if I split the difference on the aim.

No static at all · 16-Feb-2013, 7:55 PM

Pulling straws here, but I'm wondering if it has something to do with the Direct TV splitter?

As far as VHF goes, I find VHF inside the attic to suffer quite a bit compared to UHF's with fringe signals like yours. I am using an attic mounted 91XG & YA-1713 feeding 3 sets with a 3414. The main Baltimore UHF's are good 24/7, but 11 & 13 are unwatchable, except very late at night until 10:00 in the morning. Otherwise, I am seeing all the way down to WBFF-45 after trying every possible location in the attic.

16-Feb-2013, 8:35 PM

My evaluation , A tangled Mess with multipul defective equipment through out the tangled mess.

Recommendation , Remove ->ALL<- of tangled mess.

Recommendation. 1 Step at a time , build a Practical and Useful reception system.

-->Repair or replace ALL defective coax and connectors.<--

For 1 Tv connected use No splitter. No amplifier.

For 2 Tv's connected use a New CM3412 distribution amplifier.
The coaxes from the CM3412 outputs will go directly the 2 Tv's , there will be no other splitters or amplifiers connected.

For 3 or 4 Tv's connected , use a New CM3414 distribution amplifier , The coaxes from the outputs of the CM3414 distribution amplifier will go out to each Tv location and there will be no other splitters or amplifiers in the coax lines that go out to each Tv location.

For more then 4 tv locations use a CM3418 distribution amplifier , the coaxes from the CM3418 distribution amplifier will go out to each Tv location and there will be no other splitters or amplifiers in the coax lines that go out to the Tv locations.

Repair or replace ALL defective Tv's , and any other defective electronic equipment.

__________________

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Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

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http://www.ronard.com/909911.html , if using the tripod antenna mount use the 5 foot tripod antenna mount.

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________

As always , trees and tree leaves do a good job of , reflecting , absorbing , blocking , Digital Broadcast Tv reception and so do buildings and other obstructions including your own roof and house.

It is best install the HD7698P antenna at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions of any type or kind in the directions of reception including your own roof and house.

The Digital Tv's Must Channel Scan for the , OTA= Over The Air , Digital Broadcast Tv stations/channels , often named the 'Air Channels' or 'Antenna Channels' in the Tv Setup menu because the Tv transmissions travel through the Air from the transmitting antenna to the receiving antenna.

Some Digital Tv's will automatic channel scan for cable tv channels.

DO NOT channel scan for cable tv channels.

Go into the Tv Setup Menu and select , 'Air Channels' / 'Antenna Channels'.

nmh5028 · 17-Feb-2013, 3:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teleview

My evaluation , A tangled Mess with multipul defective equipment through out the tangled mess.

Recommendation , Remove ->ALL<- of tangled mess.

Recommendation. 1 Step at a time , build a Practical and Useful reception system.

-->Repair or replace ALL defective coax and connectors.<--

For 1 Tv connected use No splitter. No amplifier.

For 2 Tv's connected use a New CM3412 distribution amplifier.
The coaxes from the CM3412 outputs will go directly the 2 Tv's , there will be no other splitters or amplifiers connected.

For 3 or 4 Tv's connected , use a New CM3414 distribution amplifier , The coaxes from the outputs of the CM3414 distribution amplifier will go out to each Tv location and there will be no other splitters or amplifiers in the coax lines that go out to each Tv location.

For more then 4 tv locations use a CM3418 distribution amplifier , the coaxes from the CM3418 distribution amplifier will go out to each Tv location and there will be no other splitters or amplifiers in the coax lines that go out to the Tv locations.

Repair or replace ALL defective Tv's , and any other defective electronic equipment.

__________________

Above the Peak of the Roof install a New Winegard HD7698P antenna aimed at about 345 degree magnetic compass direction.

I appreciate the suggestions but replacing all of my new equipment, rewiring my entire house, and buying all new TVs doesn't really fit in my schedule or budget. Also, as I mentioned in my first post, mounting on the roof is not an option.