What's the best set up for my situation?

[nicole]

Please help me choose the best option. http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...46ae7e2a1da609

I want to replace satellite with free OTA channels. I’ve never had an antenna so I don’t know exactly what I need to do. I need to get all the main local network stations (ABC, CBS, FOX, CW, and NBC. PBS also if possible). I will be getting one of the new TiVo Roamio DVRs that has 4 tuners. A rotor won’t work, since the DVR will need to be able to record up to 4 different channels at one time, so I will need 2 antennas. I'm leaning towards the Winegard HD8200U which is slightly cheaper and I read is supposed to have slightly more gain. Is this the best option for me? (or possibly the channel master 5020- if that's a better option). I also need pre-amp recommendations-which one would work best for my situation? I would like to mount them on a pole/poles instead of the metal roof. Any recommendations for a specific sturdy pole, mast and whatever else I need to mount the antennas? How high would the pole need to be to get the best reception without blowing around in storms? Weather- we do get icy/snowy winters sometimes and high winds during tornado season…. Is there anything else I’m missing?

[GroundUrMast]

The 8200 includes elements that are intended to provide Low-VHF capability. These are the long elements at the rear of the antenna that add so much to its' width. You don't have any Low-VHF signals showing on your report that would be receivable. So I'm not convinced the 8200 is the best fit for your application.

If the goal is to build an antenna system that has no rotator, but can receive the major networks and need no manual switching, I'd start with an Antennas Direct 91XG or DB8e (the 91XG being my preference given the weaker signals are in the upper end of the UHF band) aimed at 20° (compass). Connect the antenna to the UHF port of an RCA TVPRAMP1R preamplifier. Add an Antennacraft Y10713 High-VHF antenna pointing at about 30° (compass), adjusting aim to make reception of both WBNA and WHAS reliable. The Y10713 connects to the VHF input of the preamplifier.

While you are testing during initial installation, turn the UHF antenna toward WBKI to verify the signal is receivable. Presuming WBKI is received reliably, you can add a third antenna to the system, another UHF antenna such as the 91XG or DB8e (The DB8e gets the nod given this the goal is to make real CH-19 reliable), dedicated to WBKI. This antenna needs it's own preamplifier. I'd opt for an Antennas Direct PA-18.

Run the outputs of the PA-18 and TVPRAMP1R separately. Check with tinlee.com for pricing and availability of an AC-7 that is configured for OTA channel 19. The AC-7 is a filter devise that will allow your to combine a single channel antenna (19 in this case) with a multiple channel antenna.

The power supplies for the preamplifiers and AC-7 combiner can all be indoors, protected from the elements. The length of cable runs and number of TVs and DVRs will determine if a distribution amplifier is needed. Ideally the power supplies, combiner, distribution amplifier and splitter would all be located at the point where all the cable come together.

10' sections of antenna mast used to be easy to find in local shops. For whatever reason, 5' seems to be all that's stocked anymore. I have transitioned to chain-link fence top rail when in need of a 10' mast with no joints. These work well with tripods, eve brackets and chimney mounts. They can also be stacked if suporrted with guy wire. http://www.homedepot.com/p/YARDGARD-...2#.Uo3RzCePU4w

http://www.tinlee.com/MATV_headend.p...IGNALINJECTORS
http://www.3starinc.com/
http://www.solidsignal.com/c/product...ennas-supplies
http://www.antennacraft.net/Antennas/AntennasVHF.html
http://www.antennasdirect.com/
http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=901
http://www.amazon.com/RCA-TVPRAMP1R-...ords=tvpramp1r

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The provided Tvfool report is at the default 10 feet above ground antenna height.

Please make 2 more Tv fool reports , 25 and 40 feet above ground antenna heights.

25 feet antenna height above ground is a Reference antenna height that provides a good idea of what is receivable.

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WBKI and WMYO have the same programing so no requirement to receive WBKI , www.wikipedia.org/wiki/WBKI-TV

www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WMYO

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And WKZT , PBS is the same as WKPC , PBS .
http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken...nal/Television

So no requirement to receive WKZT.

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I suspect that 1 antenna aimed in 1 direction will receive all the receivable Tv stations.

So please make and post the Tvfool reports with your exact address with 25 and 40 feet antenna heights.

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The Current Tv channels that are being transmitted and received in the , USA , Canada, Mexico , are

VHF low band channels 2 thru 6 .

VHF high band channels 7 thru 13 .

UHF band channels 14 thru 51 .

The Tvfool channel list shows the Real channels that are transmitted and received

And

Shows the (virt) Virtual numbers .

I see no , Current , Real low band channels that are receivable .

So a antenna that receives the VHF high band and UHF band channels will be Ok .

So that I can recommend a correct antenna , please make and post Tvfool reports at 25 and 40 feet antenna heights.

[nicole]

Thanks for the replies so far. I'll take all the help I can get

Here's the report for 25' http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...46ae1c9de7e57d

and 40' http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...46aec61c413556

[GroundUrMast]

Presuming the reports are based on the actual antenna location (+/- a few hundred feet) there does not appear to be much to gained by going up above your roof top by any more than the height of a single 10' mast section.

If your report is based on an approximate LAT/LON we may be working with data that is far from representative of your true situation.

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Based on the provided Tvfool reports.

Going to 40 feet antenna height above ground has no useful increase in signal strength.

And looking at the signal strengths at the 10 foot antenna height and the 25 foot antenna height , looks like a antenna height above ground of about 20 to 25 feet or so above ground will receive the receivable Tv stations with 1 antenna aimed in 1 direction.

Recommend install a Antenna Craft , HBU44 antenna above the Peak of the Roof in such a manner that the roof and building are not , obstructing , impeding , blocking , reception in the directions of , North East , East .

Aim the HBU44 antenna at about 30 degree magnetic compass direction .

Here is how to aim antennas , www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html .

Use a Real and Actual magnetic compass to aim antenna .

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Install a Channel Master CM7778 Preamplifier .

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For 1 Tv connected use No splitter .

For 2 Tv's connected use a , Holland Electronics , HFS-2D , 2 way splitter .

For 3 Tv's connected use a , Holland Electronics , HFS-3D , 3 way splitter .

Buy the HFS splitters at , www.solidsignal.com

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Here are some above the roof antenna mounts .

www.ronard.com/909911.html
Use the , ronard(911) , 5 foot tripod antenna mount .

www.ronard.com/Tripods%200703/4712.html
Use the 10 foot tripod antenna mount.

www.ronard.com/34424560.html
Use the , ronard(4560) , eave antenna mount .

www.ronard.com/ychim.html
Measure around the chimney and use a , ronard(2212) , ronard(2218) , ronard(2224) .

Buy the ronard antenna mounts at , www.solidsignal.com , by typing , ronard(x) , in the solidsignal search box or buy from www.ronard.com .

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The Tv/s Must Channel Scan for the , OTA=Over The Air , Digital Broadcast Tv stations channels , often named the ~DTV Channels ~ Antenna Channels ~ Air Channels ~ in the Tv Setup Menu because the Tv transmissions travel through the Air from the transmitting antenna to the receiving antenna .

Some digital Tv's will Automatic channel scan for cable Tv channels.

DO NOT channel scan for cable Tv channels .

Go into the Tv Setup Menu and select ~ DTV Channels ~ Antenna Channels ~ Air Channels ~ .

Scan for channels .

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Here are some places to buy antennas and etc. .

www.solidsignal.com

www.amazon.com

www.antennacraft.net

www.channelmaster.com

www.ronard.com

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As Always , trees and tree leaves , plants and plant leaves , have a Negative Effect on Broadcast Tv Reception and so do buildings and other obstructions including your own roof and building .

Some and not all Negative Effects are

Absorbing , Blocking , Reception

Multi-Path reflections bouncing all around.

The Best Practice is to install the HBU44 antenna at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions of any type or kind in the directions of reception .

Some satellite systems will accept and distribute Tv antenna signals and some satellite systems , Will Not .

The best way to avoid problems Tv antenna reception and distribution is to , Disconnet and Remove satellite system components such as and not limited to , multi-plexers , diplexers , splitters , couplers , amplifiers , power injectors , power supply's , receivers and etc. , so that only the antenna system components make up the antenna system .

Yes is Ok to use satellite system coaxes for the antenna distribution.

[nicole]

I used google earth and stuck a pin on the actual roof of my house and got the exact coordinates from that, so they should be as accurate as google earth is.... I'm still not sure what to do, because the 2 suggestions seem to be contradicting each other

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To clear the issue of location and reception.

Go to the Tvfool home page and click on , >>Start MAPS<< , move the pointer to your exact location and enter the antenna height above ground and click on the Make Radar Map button.

Please make Tvfool reports at all 3 Tv antenna heights and post the Tvfool reports.

Thanks

[GroundUrMast]

I used google earth and stuck a pin on the actual roof of my house and got the exact coordinates from that, so they should be as accurate as google earth is.... I'm still not sure what to do, because the 2 suggestions seem to be contradicting each other

Thanks, just checking.

Actually, we are both agreeing on your need to use an antenna or combination of antennas that do very well with UHF and High-VHF signals.

The HBU-44 or HBU-55 is a viable 'one antenna' solution. The CM-7778 is fine, with it's single input.

The 91XG and Y10713 offer just a bit more performance and the flexibility to fine tune the aim independently. The TVPRAMP1R is comparable in performance to the CM-7778 and has the option of separate inputs for the UHF and VHF antennas.

As teleview has pointed out, it's unlikely you will need to consider an additional antenna aimed south.

[nicole]

Thanks for clearing that up and thanks for all the info. This should be enough to get me started. I'll probably have more questions later, once I make a decision on the equipment.

[nicole]

I have a couple questions already. I was researching, trying to figure out the benefits of 2 separate directional antennas (I believe you said that would be Antennas Direct 91XG aimed at 20° for UHF and an Antennacraft Y10713 High-VHF antenna pointing at about 30° adjusting aim to make reception of both WBNA and WHAS reliable- would this be enough to get the 137° channel 19?) vs a single antenna for both UHF and VHF (UB44or 55). If I understand correctly, the 91XG will pick up the stations 14-69 better and more clear then the HBU44? Does anyone know if the Hbu-44 or -55 pointed at 30° would be able to pick up both the 19/20° and still be able to pick up the 137° VHF channel 19 or is that too big of a range? or if the 2 antenna solution would be better for all the channels? Is there ever interference with 2 or 3 antennas? If I do end up needing to add another antenna pointed south to get channel 19, could I add it if I choose a UBU44/55 or would that cause interference? Ground mount- If I choose 2 antennas, do i need 2 poles, how far apart?

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Channel 19 and the other Tv station to the south do need to be received because those networks are also to the , north east.

Aim the the HBU44 as directed for reception of the the Tv stations to the , north east and channel 8 to the east.

As always the starting antenna aim direction is the --> starting antenna aim direction.
The antenna aim direction can be adjusted for for best reception.

Most Digital Tv's have a Signal Strength Meter and some Digital Tv's also have a Signal Quality Meter.

[GroundUrMast]

More than one antenna can be mounted on the same mast (pole). It's best to have at least 3' of clearance above and below an antenna. That means that a 5' mast on the roof is going to be less than ideal for mounting two antennas. A 10' mast would provide plenty of separation for two antennas and adequate space for three.

Back to my first post... I'm suggesting you start with a system capable of receiving the available signals from the NNE. With that basic equipment you can test the reception from other directions and decide if there is any reason to invest more money in additional capabilities.

My prediction is that with a single antenna, you will not find a compromise aim point that gives simultaneous reliable reception of the signals from the NNE and SE. The reason; The antennas needed to deal with the rather weak signals are necessarily directional and therefore receive well toward the front and very poorly from the sides. However, if there is no signal of interest from the SE, save your money.

If you opt to add reception of a UHF signal from the south, you'll be facing a bit of a technical challenge when you try to combine it into the main system. The filter device I mentioned would be one way to combine two antenna systems that would otherwise interfere with each other.

Again, start with the basics, then add to the system if indicated.

[StephanieS]

Hi Nicole,

I am an owner of a two antenna system (91xg and a RCA ANT751).



Looking at your radar plot, I come down with GroundUrMast suggestion of testing with one antenna, then if a two antenna application is needed, invest in setting it up. I will say though a two antenna application I feel would be something if you are in it for the long term I would go for pretty quickly. The set up choice I'd go for would be a 91xg being pointed at 150 magnetic. The second antenna I would consider being a Winegard HD7698P aimed at 23 magnetic.

91xg: CW, PBS
HD7698: ABC, CBS, FOX, MyNet, NBC, PBS (ION too, it is so strong you should see it while not pointed at it)

If going after the two antenna application, I would mount a tripod on the roof with a 10' pole and mount the 91xg on the top, then the HD7698 3 or 4' below.

I would run these as separate systems, meaning coaxes come off each antenna on their own down to a A/B switch in your home and depending on what channel you want to watch, you switch over.

I would also install an RCA preamp on BOTH antennas. Place the power supply for the preamp on the lead coming into your house, just before the A/B Switch.

My system has two separate leads and inside I have my A/B switch to go between the beam and the little antenna. I have found it quite effective. My situation though, I receive most of my signals on the 91xg that the little antenna sees. The little antenna is there for VHF support and as a back up should the 91xg have any problems.

All that said, your signals for NBC and the CW are weak. You may experience a drop out or two. 2-edge conditions are a fickle thing and signals can vary. Keep your expectations reasonable. I have a red shaded 7 db signal that my beam is pointed at. 99% of the time it is reliable, but occasionally there is that whacky moment that it freezes and comes right back. Be prepared for this.

Teleview had a nice all in one solution, but I think down the road, you'll likely be happier with two dedicated antennas that each serve all the signals you are trying for. Taking a big bite with one antenna may bring many of the signals in, but two antennas allows you the freedom to really dedicate resources to each set of towers a one antenna solution wouldn't.

RE: CW simulcast of WBKI RF 19 on WMYO digital subchannel 58.3. Yes, the CW programming will be available via WMYO (magnetic 23). However, the flexibility of the two antenna system is nice to receive both signals should one go down. I enjoy that with my beam. I have two CBS affiliates at my reception.

Best of luck!