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Old 17-Jan-2015, 5:29 PM   #1
bonesrock
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OTA help

We moved into the rural Ozarks and decided to stay OTA. A dish was our only option and we just didn't want to go back to that. We are on a lake about 120 vertical feet above the surface. We have lots of trees and hills, but to the North they are further away.

I built an antenna, 10 pairs of 7 inch whiskers with the tips about 3 inches apart. We currently receive broadcast channels (real channel) #10 (10), 27 (28), 33 (19) and occasionally channel 51 (50).

Two close neighbors are using the much advertised lava type antennas and are getting several additional channels. Broadcast numbrrs 8, 21, 3, 49 and maybe a couple of others.

Channel 10, CBS is our favorite so we are relatively happy, but I like to tinker and would like to get 51 on a regular basis. Any equipment suggestions?

The home brew antenna photo is facing generally North.

thanks
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Old 17-Jan-2015, 5:45 PM   #2
Tim
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It would be helpful to everyone if you would follow the posting guidelines and provide the information required. That will allow the experts here to make suggestions based on your specific location.
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Old 18-Jan-2015, 2:39 AM   #3
bonesrock
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report

I thought I had attached the report info and a photo of my site. I must have made some mistake. Sorry for the problem. I did discover the photo was to large to attach. I'll work on that tomorrow when the sun's out. Thank you for your quick response btw.
The report is:

'tvfool.com/? Option=com_wrapper&itemid=29&q=id% 3d2c15668d3ed6fo'

I also ran the interactive map and that report ends in '152ee758acef'

No preamps, just 100 ft of RG 6 with factory crimped ends.

Last edited by bonesrock; 18-Jan-2015 at 2:49 AM. Reason: more info
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Old 18-Jan-2015, 11:39 AM   #4
timgr
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You need to post a report link like this -

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...d243d9bf698595

Copy and paste the entire URL to your message.
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Old 18-Jan-2015, 9:49 PM   #5
rickbb
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What kind of antenna did you build that uses 10 pairs of 7" wiskers 3" apart?
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Old 19-Jan-2015, 2:22 AM   #6
bonesrock
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Soooo, maybe I can get it right on the third attempt. I got busy today and forgot about taking a picture of my antenna before the sun went down. I used some measurements I found on the interwebs to build from. That was before doing reading on this site.

I started with 20 pieces of 6ga copper, 18 inches long. I bent them in half with the tips at 3 inches apart. The mast was 2 inch pvc elec. conduit. I put a pair of holes 3/4 inches apart down 1 side spaced vertically at 7 inches.

I used 14ga copper to solder both parts of each whisker 7 inches from the ends. The top two pairs are connected straight down to the second pair, then cross over. Each two pair follows that pattern.

That is a horrible discription, but the best I can give right now. I just got off work and took some cold pills. It makes it hard to focus, like I got cotton in my head. I'll get a picture in the morning.

Thank you for your patience with me.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...2c15668d3ed6f0
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...2c152ee758acef
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Old 19-Jan-2015, 3:31 PM   #7
bonesrock
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Smile

Here is a picture of the antenna and one facing North as well. I hope they answer sone questions. The exact location is 36.58326 by -93.56376.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Homebrew.jpg (61.5 KB, 429 views)
File Type: jpg 20150119_091756.jpg (231.4 KB, 420 views)
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Old 19-Jan-2015, 6:49 PM   #8
rickbb
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Wow, according to that radar plot you're lucky to get much at all. Only 2 stations not in the grey, all 2Edge, all but one with a negative NM value and most with a co-channel warning.

You are going to need a large, high gain antenna, maybe a rotor and pre-amp. You also have several VHF, both low and high channels. This most likely will require a 2nd VHF only antenna.
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Old 21-Jan-2015, 3:14 AM   #9
bonesrock
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Challenges

With the antenna I made, I didn't put a reflector on it so I had a better chance of pulling in 51. In my future I will be putting a tripod mount on the roof. That will gain 10 or more feet to my setup. We just moved a modular building on site and are converting into a house. Right now the antenna is on a 20 ft. pipe clamped to a 4x4 deck post.

It's interesting, but I am very rural and have a great view. My wife would like to get the pbs channel 21 back so I think I'll need to add a second vhf (?) antenna to get it back. For now as long as CBS on channel 10 stays strong I'm happy.

I'm just not sure why that little Lava antenna my neighbor uses does so good.
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Old 21-Jan-2015, 3:01 PM   #10
rickbb
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I've looked all over the internet for the type of antenna you built and can't find anything on it.

If you want to make your own I can recommend Mclapps DB4 or DB8. I have made several of the 10 x 9.5 DB4's and can say they just work great for me.

Here is his home page.

http://m4antenna.eastmasonvilleweather.com/index.html

There are also other good designs out there for Gray Hoverman and Yagi styles.

Also the PBS 21 station is not VHF, but UHF real channel 23. Your CBS channel 10 is however a VHF and so is 7 also a CBS.

Last edited by rickbb; 21-Jan-2015 at 3:06 PM. Reason: Add info on PBS channel
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Old 23-Jan-2015, 4:28 AM   #11
bonesrock
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Here is a bit of back story on the Frankenstein antenna. We lived in Kansas City but went to our place on Table Rock lake weekends. When the conversion with tv happened I decided to build an antenna. I read and made notes, but didn't really mind not having TV on the weekend trips so nothing got built.

A couple of years ago we decided to move and I must have mixed some of my notes up and built what I have. Scary thing is it beats the antenna I bought just before we decided to move.

so now I want to either build correctly or buy something. I would build a vertical 8 bay like the site you referenced below. If buying the DB8e seems to be the rage here with a y10713 for channel 10 with a uvsj to combine.

My focus is 10 kolr and 33 (19) kspr are top priority, 21 pbs, 27 kozl are next and 3 kytv, 51 knwa are after that. More are a bonus. One issue is I have everything but 3 and 21 right now and the price tag to buy seems high if there's not much gain.

Is there an obvious advantage to anything I've layed out?

Am I thinking this through correctly?
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Old 23-Jan-2015, 7:28 AM   #12
GroundUrMast
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The reports you've posted show that you are down in a hole (so to speak). Signal levels in the are are predicted to be extremely weak. I would only consider using the largest, highest performance antennas available. Even then, you need some good fortune.

Mount high, and completely free of obstructions such as trees and buildings.

I would try the Antennas Direct DB8E or the 91XG to go after the real channels 14 and higher. The Antennacraft Y10713 is the only store bought antenna that has a chance at the real channels ranging from 7 to 13. Virtual Channel numbers have no bearing on antenna selection.

I would go so far as to install a PA-18 preamp on each antenna, then combine the UHF and VHF signals after the power insertion blocks that are indoors (protected from the elements). The idea here is to squeeze every last bit of noise performance out of the antennas and preamps. (Placing the UHF/VHF combiner on the output side of the preamps prevents the 1 dB or less insertion loss of the combiner from affecting the overall noise performance of the system.)

If you want to try a DIY antenna build, consider the GH10n3: http://clients.teksavvy.com/~nickm/g..._9V7_15u0.html

Having said all that, your posted reports force me to warn you that you may not get reliable reception at that location, regardless of the antenna(s) you choose. Be prepared to experiment with increased antenna mounting height... and alternate locations for the mast...
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If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)

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Old 26-Jan-2015, 6:24 AM   #13
bonesrock
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elevations

I spent some time and was able to locate the above sea level elevation for channel 10, KOLR in Springfield. The hole we are in is approx. 50 feet in elevation lower than the transmitting antenna.

This makes sense to me since I get a decent signal with a very poorly designed homemade antenna as does my neighbor with his Lava antenna. Springfield is in a relatively level area so without spending my data package to look at each transmitter, I would guess roughly similar elevations for the other stations.

I want to thank you for your reply. I don't thing the heroic measures will be in my immediate future., however using the two antennas mentioned seems a good place to start along with raising my antennas to the roof with a five foot tripod and ten foot of mast and some careful aiming. That increases my antenns height about twenty feet above where my antenna is now.

Bone
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