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Old 4-Sep-2013, 3:51 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Damon459 View Post
Just spoke with the fine folks at solid signal and the recommended the Winegard HD 7084P, Attenuator: 1296F, and Amplifier: AP8700.
As ADTech has already said in their own way... Wow, I don't see how they come up with that recommendation...

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Remote control A/B antenna switching Is Channel Surfing Friendly , press the button on the hand held remote control , change antennas and keep on channel surfing.
True, so long as your TV(s) can learn new channels without forgetting those already learned. One of the TV's in our house will not play nice with an A/B switch, it requires a complete rescan when switched to a second antenna.
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Old 4-Sep-2013, 5:08 AM   #22
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Ok guy's sorry I took too much faith in the "expert" at solid signal, that's why I posted it here to see if anyone agreed. I'm no expert in Antenna's and I won't claim to be one, which is why I depend on the people of this forum to save me from buying another antenna that will just disappoint me. I've decided to go with the Winegard HD 7698 as suggested. As for using an A/B switch I don't think it will be an issue, I've had my current antenna go funny and the tv had no issue remembering the channels it already had. I'm hoping the same will prove true the OTA tuner for my DishHopper so that I can record, if not I'll have to see if my tv will play nice with an external HD for a PVR setup. Thanks to everyone for the help and advise, I will post my success when the new antenna is up and running.
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Old 21-Sep-2013, 8:11 AM   #23
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Question Interesting development in tv reception.

I wanted to post a new "issue" to see if others have experienced this. I'm still using my RCA-ANT751 and RCA TVPRAMP 1R, and today I relocated my tv to the opposite side of my mobile home without moving the Antenna. Strangely enough my feeds are coming in stronger, not a lot strong but enough that the picture no longer pixilates. I'm still using the same cable and the same connectors, the only difference is the cable line now runs over the roof of my home to the opposite side and through the opposite wall. I'm curious if this is a common phenomenon?
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Old 28-Sep-2013, 3:34 AM   #24
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New Help with Signal in Montana.

Ok so I posted on here before and got some help and advise but I need to update the issue's and current setup. I'm currently using a rca ant751 while I wait on a replacement antenna. I was using the rca tvpramp1r and found it was actually lowering my signals according to the tv's on screen meter, so I removed it at returned it. When I say lowered the signal I actually lost all signal to KPAX-DT and dropped the signal on K14IUD from 75-80 to 60-65. Currently I'm receiving a signal of 52 on KPAXDT and 75 on K14IUD, and an intermittent signal of 15 on KUFMTV. The Antenna is actually pointed at 180 rather then the tv fool recommended 314, because when pointed at 314 I receive nothing at all regardless of height of the antenna. I even tried going 30 feet up as nothing, but when pointed at 180 I get the channels mentioned. I did a radar plot using interactive coverage map and even was able to put the pointer right were the antenna is mounted on the house. So I would like anyone willing to help to look over this and help me with a selection of the best antenna/preamp for my situation. I would "ideally" like to receive KPAX-DT, K14IU-D, and KUFM-TV, I found KTMF-DT to be possible occasionally with a Clearstream 2 pointed at roughly 258 degree's and and "pointed" at a 45 degree angle, this channel isn't mandator but would be "nice". http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...46ae076714107d Not sure if it's possible to link the Interactive TV Coverage Browser but my coordinates are 46.883643,-113.888187, and based on lots of checking found the antenna needs to be lower rather then higher do to the deep valley I'm in. I forgot to add contrary to TV Fool K14IU-D I actually have line of sight, IE I can look out my door and clearly see the tower, you can even pick it up with cheap rabbit ears, though the signal is usually only around 45-50. Also if it makes any difference when it comes to signals I'm in a trailer park.

Last edited by Damon459; 28-Sep-2013 at 3:37 AM. Reason: Forgot to add important details.
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Old 28-Sep-2013, 5:30 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Damon459 View Post
I wanted to post a new "issue" to see if others have experienced this. I'm still using my RCA-ANT751 and RCA TVPRAMP 1R, and today I relocated my tv to the opposite side of my mobile home without moving the Antenna. Strangely enough my feeds are coming in stronger, not a lot strong but enough that the picture no longer pixilates. I'm still using the same cable and the same connectors, the only difference is the cable line now runs over the roof of my home to the opposite side and through the opposite wall. I'm curious if this is a common phenomenon?
Have you made certain that the coax connectors are secure. The symptoms make me suspect a poor shield connection in a connector.
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Old 28-Sep-2013, 5:53 AM   #26
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Ok so I posted on here before and got some help and advise but I need to update the issue's and current setup. I'm currently using a rca ant751 while I wait on a replacement antenna. I was using the rca tvpramp1r and found it was actually lowering my signals according to the tv's on screen meter, so I removed it at returned it. When I say lowered the signal I actually lost all signal to KPAX-DT and dropped the signal on K14IUD from 75-80 to 60-65. Currently I'm receiving a signal of 52 on KPAXDT and 75 on K14IUD, and an intermittent signal of 15 on KUFMTV. The Antenna is actually pointed at 180 rather then the tv fool recommended 314, because when pointed at 314 I receive nothing at all regardless of height of the antenna. I even tried going 30 feet up as nothing, but when pointed at 180 I get the channels mentioned. I did a radar plot using interactive coverage map and even was able to put the pointer right were the antenna is mounted on the house. So I would like anyone willing to help to look over this and help me with a selection of the best antenna/preamp for my situation. I would "ideally" like to receive KPAX-DT, K14IU-D, and KUFM-TV, I found KTMF-DT to be possible occasionally with a Clearstream 2 pointed at roughly 258 degree's and and "pointed" at a 45 degree angle, this channel isn't mandator but would be "nice". http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...46ae076714107d Not sure if it's possible to link the Interactive TV Coverage Browser but my coordinates are 46.883643,-113.888187, and based on lots of checking found the antenna needs to be lower rather then higher do to the deep valley I'm in. I forgot to add contrary to TV Fool K14IU-D I actually have line of sight, IE I can look out my door and clearly see the tower, you can even pick it up with cheap rabbit ears, though the signal is usually only around 45-50. Also if it makes any difference when it comes to signals I'm in a trailer park.
Your actual experience with K14IU-D suggests a UHF antenna smaller than the 91XG may suffice. I still prefer the 91XG for it's ability to tilt (a unique feature designed into the mast-to-boom clamp mechanism. However the Gain of the Antennas Direct DB4e would be on par with the 91XG at that frequency... And it's much more compact than the 91XG. (I own one of each and would not want to part with either.)

That leaves the signals in the range of real CH-7 through 13. The Antennacraft Y10713 is the 'big gun' in that band of frequencies.

I suspect the RCA preamp you got may have had a problem, I've head reports of low quality switches that select combiner and trap configuration. Try the Antennas Direct PA-18 and an external UHF/VHF combiner such as the Antennas Direct EU385CF.

This two antenna approach let's you aim the two antennas independently, a very helpful 'plus' in your situation.
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Last edited by GroundUrMast; 28-Sep-2013 at 5:56 AM.
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Old 28-Sep-2013, 7:14 AM   #27
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Have you made certain that the coax connectors are secure. The symptoms make me suspect a poor shield connection in a connector.
I'm only using dual shield currently, but I did buy a tool kit for RG-6 compression fittings from Home Depot. I followed the instructions to the letter, so I'm guessing I need that Quad shielded RG-6 instead?
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Old 28-Sep-2013, 7:24 AM   #28
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Your actual experience with K14IU-D suggests a UHF antenna smaller than the 91XG may suffice. I still prefer the 91XG for it's ability to tilt (a unique feature designed into the mast-to-boom clamp mechanism. However the Gain of the Antennas Direct DB4e would be on par with the 91XG at that frequency... And it's much more compact than the 91XG. (I own one of each and would not want to part with either.)

That leaves the signals in the range of real CH-7 through 13. The Antennacraft Y10713 is the 'big gun' in that band of frequencies.

I suspect the RCA preamp you got may have had a problem, I've head reports of low quality switches that select combiner and trap configuration. Try the Antennas Direct PA-18 and an external UHF/VHF combiner such as the Antennas Direct EU385CF.

This two antenna approach let's you aim the two antennas independently, a very helpful 'plus' in your situation.
I suspected as much with the preamp so I did already return in, thankfully I got it at walmart and they have a 90 day return policy. I considered buying another one but wanted to seek your awesome advice first. As for the antenna the antenna craft Y10713 it's on order already . For the UHF I read a comparison here http://www.antennahacks.com/Comparis..._vs_PR9032.htm and wondered your thoughts. I'm not concerned with size, but I have to wonder about the cost difference IE is the Antennas Direct 91XG really worth the 60 dollars more? If you still feel the Antennas Direct 91XG is the better of the two I will take your word for it, since you haven't given me any bad advise at all and full trust your expertise in this. As for the combiner I'm glad you brought it up because that would have been my next question on this post. So either you're just that good at helping us newbies or your have ESP
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Old 28-Sep-2013, 6:17 PM   #29
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Quad shield is not going to help, the antenna allows desired signal along with whatever interference is in the air into the coax. The extremely small amount of signal or interference that could leak in through the shield of standard coax is already much much less than you need to be concerned with. If the signal meter reading is stable when you wiggle the coax at the connector, it's probably just fine, I've yet to have trouble with any compression style connector. (Crimp connectors are a different story....)

Both the 91XG and PR9032 are designs that covered channels 14 to 69. They both tend to favor the higher channels. If cost is an issue, and you already get K14IU-D with an small indoor antenna, the DB4e would be my choice. It's a newer design, concentrating on real channels 14 to 51, which gives it better performance than older antennas of a similar configuration. The DB4e is also going to have less wind loading.
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Old 2-Oct-2013, 2:06 AM   #30
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Quad shield is not going to help, the antenna allows desired signal along with whatever interference is in the air into the coax. The extremely small amount of signal or interference that could leak in through the shield of standard coax is already much much less than you need to be concerned with. If the signal meter reading is stable when you wiggle the coax at the connector, it's probably just fine, I've yet to have trouble with any compression style connector. (Crimp connectors are a different story....)

Both the 91XG and PR9032 are designs that covered channels 14 to 69. They both tend to favor the higher channels. If cost is an issue, and you already get K14IU-D with an small indoor antenna, the DB4e would be my choice. It's a newer design, concentrating on real channels 14 to 51, which gives it better performance than older antennas of a similar configuration. The DB4e is also going to have less wind loading.
New Development, I'm now picking up Real Channel 8 which is channel 7 AKA K08PR-D with as well as K14IU-D and KPAX-DT. Signals are as follows with the RCA ANT751 no pre-amp, K08PR-D 48-52, KPAX-DT 48-52, K14IU-D 82-84 based on my tv signal meter. I'm happy with these channels for the time being as I'm trying to convince KTMF-DT to put a repeater onto the same tower as K14IU-D giving me all the locals if I can convince them. Based on these numbers I'm actually happy with my existing antenna but wondered which pre-amp would be based based on these numbers? Obviously I don't need as powerful a pre-amp as I once thought, so should I try another rca tvpramp1r or should I go higher price with the PA18 UHF / VHF Antenna Pre-Amplifier Kit or this might sound crazy but what about the Micron Variable In-Line Amplifier Kit ? I'm curious about the Micron Variable In-Line Amplifier Kit because it has 3 settings. I know I'm getting to be a bit of a pest here so please bare with me if this works I'll be happy.
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Old 2-Oct-2013, 3:01 AM   #31
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...I know I'm getting to be a bit of a pest here so please bare with me...
I don't think you're a pest.

If the signals are stable/reliable, and you have no need to run more cable, why add an amplifier at all?

If you plan to add more TVs to your system or change the location of your TV so that more cable is needed, then a preamp may be in order.

If you truly need a preamp due to existing or future cable & splitting losses and are going to stick with one antenna, then opt for the PA-18 which is an excellent weak signal amplifier with very good noise specifications.

If you plan on building a two antenna system such as the DB4e and Y10713, then use a TVPRAMP1R.

Based on the combination of the information in your TV Fool report and your on-site reports, should I move in next door, you'd see my DB4e, Y10713 and TVPRAMP1R hoisted proudly up the mast.
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Old 2-Oct-2013, 3:10 AM   #32
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I don't think you're a pest.

If the signals are stable/reliable, and you have no need to run more cable, why add an amplifier at all?

If you plan to add more TVs to your system or change the location of your TV so that more cable is needed, then a preamp may be in order.

If you truly need a preamp due to existing or future cable & splitting losses and are going to stick with one antenna, then opt for the PA-18 which is an excellent weak signal amplifier with very good noise specifications.

If you plan on building a two antenna system such as the DB4e and Y10713, then use a TVPRAMP1R.

Based on the combination of the information in your TV Fool report and your on-site reports, should I move in next door, you'd see my DB4e, Y10713 and TVPRAMP1R hoisted proudly up the mast.
Well I am thinking future here but here's the thing right now I'm only on 1 tv with my system and want to add a tv, the only issue is I'm with DISH rather then directv and the Hopper can only add one OAT Tuner that can show on both tv's but you must watch the same channel so I may later add that other line for the other tv for independent viewing. Until then my line is actually too long, it's about 40 feet long but I only need 25 feet. Do you think I should shorten it? I'm still planning on going to the two antenna set up so I did order a replacement TVPRAMP1R to have on hand when I can afford to get both the DB4e and the Y10713. I plan on getting the Y10713 first since it's cheaper and using the RCA-ANT751 until I can swing the DB4e. Thanks for the help I really to appreciate it. I could live with just the locals from Dish if if wasn't for the sub-channels they don't carry.
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Old 2-Oct-2013, 11:08 AM   #33
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Well I am thinking future here but here's the thing right now I'm only on 1 tv with my system and want to add a tv, the only issue is I'm with DISH rather then directv and the Hopper can only add one OAT Tuner that can show on both tv's but you must watch the same channel so I may later add that other line for the other tv for independent viewing. Until then my line is actually too long, it's about 40 feet long but I only need 25 feet. Do you think I should shorten it? I'm still planning on going to the two antenna set up so I did order a replacement TVPRAMP1R to have on hand when I can afford to get both the DB4e and the Y10713. I plan on getting the Y10713 first since it's cheaper and using the RCA-ANT751 until I can swing the DB4e. Thanks for the help I really to appreciate it. I could live with just the locals from Dish if if wasn't for the sub-channels they don't carry.
This is odd to me but I shorted the cable which was draped across my roof and poof channel 7 which is my other pbs is gone. Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought cable only worked as an antenna for UHF signals?
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Old 2-Oct-2013, 5:07 PM   #34
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Cable should not be acting as an antenna. Cable should only conduct signal from the antenna to the tuner, with no signal leaking in or out along the way. Only the antenna should behave as an antenna.

This continues to make me wonder about the integrity of the connections between the coax and connectors at each end.

However, the ANT-751 is a much smaller antenna than I would specify for your situation. You may simply be receiving too weak a signal to insure reliable reception %100 of the time.
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Old 2-Oct-2013, 10:25 PM   #35
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Cable should not be acting as an antenna. Cable should only conduct signal from the antenna to the tuner, with no signal leaking in or out along the way. Only the antenna should behave as an antenna.

This continues to make me wonder about the integrity of the connections between the coax and connectors at each end.

However, the ANT-751 is a much smaller antenna than I would specify for your situation. You may simply be receiving too weak a signal to insure reliable reception %100 of the time.
Well it you ended up being right, I missed something last night the was the cause, our local thermal inversions. I didn't know they would actually cause signal issues. For all my connections I used a kit from DataShark purchased at home depot. http://www.homedepot.com/p/Paladin-D...5#.UkydDijWp7Q
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Old 11-Nov-2013, 11:46 PM   #36
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Today I received and installed my AntennaCraft Y10713 and wanted to post my results. KPAX-DT 65%, KECI-TV 65%, KUFM-TV 40%, all based on my tv's signal meter. Now I was able to get KUFM-TV at 70% is I raised the antenna higher but lost all others in the process. Interestingly enough in order to get all channels I'm pointed at 189 degree's. When pointed at the Azimuth listed on my tvfool report I get nothing, I'm assuming this is due to my 2EDGE signals. My next step which many not happen until spring is to add a UHF antenna in the hopes of getting KTMF-DT, of course by then they should have a new owner who will hopefully correct their signal problems. I know people even in town that can't get signal without a large rooftop Antenna, because they use a directional antenna pointed north and located north of town. So I want to say thanks to those who helped me during this process and I'm glad I took the advise on the AntennaCraft Y10713 it works very well and was very affordable from solid signal.
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Old 13-Nov-2013, 5:39 AM   #37
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Ok not sure anyone is reading this thread anymore, but if anyone is I have a question to ask that someone I'm sure has already asked. So I'm in an area where in order to get a station I want my report say's I need to take "extreme" measures. Now I know that's not totally true since I was able to pick up this channel using the clearstream 2V from Antennas Direct. The station is KTMF-DT which is my local ABC/FOX station. So my idea is trying to stack two Winegard HD-9023 UHF Prostar 1000's. I know GroundurMast recommended the Antenna's Direct 91XG, but doing some research shows the winegard is just as good for channels under 30, and where I live the highest channel is 23. My thinking is if I take two winegards at $30.00 a piece I get a signal increase of at least 3db at a cost of $60.00 total VS $100.00 for the 91XG. Does anyone have any thoughts, or reasons why my thinking is flawed in this situation? Still living this AntennaCraft Y10713, it's so slick and light. I just wish I had never wasted the $60.00 I spend on that RCA ANT751, considering I spend half that on the Y10713 and it out preforms by miles. Oh and if it's needed again here is my tvfool report http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...46ae8383425858
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Old 13-Nov-2013, 8:21 AM   #38
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I'm pretty sure you are referring to the HD-9032. (I transpose s'# too.)

If you're game to try your hand at stacking, it's certainly not a far fetched idea.

In practice, don't expect more than 2 dB net gain if you get everything perfect. Before going to all that fuss, I'd try one 9032 just to see if it's fine by itself. ('Keep it simple' if you can.)
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Old 13-Nov-2013, 8:35 AM   #39
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I'm pretty sure you are referring to the HD-9032. (I transpose s'# too.)

If you're game to try your hand at stacking, it's certainly not a far fetched idea.

In practice, don't expect more than 2 dB net gain if you get everything perfect. Before going to all that fuss, I'd try one 9032 just to see if it's fine by itself. ('Keep it simple' if you can.)
That makes sense, I was of course trying to research this on my own as well. I was already planning on trying one antenna first since it seems as you mentioned stacking requires getting everything perfect to get 3 dB at most, I understand that's "ideal" with a Yagi. I also wanted to pose another question since you responded. I'm using that AntennaCraft Y10713 and I do love it, but I'm seeing one "problem". In order to get all KPAX-DT, KECI-TV I need to point at about 185 degree's, I assume this is do to reflection off the mountain I'm pointed at. Now I'm also getting KUFM-TV but the signal is weaker about 37-40 while the others are in the 60's, now if I raise the antenna KUFM-TV jumps to as high as 70 but then KPAX-DT and KECI-TV drop out. Now I'm planning on trying to locate the Antenna to different area's in the hopes it might help, but it's MT and the weather may not allow me to do much before spring, so other then hunting for a better location is there any other option for this? I'll repeat the signals change only by changing height not direction in it's current location. Other then that well let's just say that antenna is my new best friend. :
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Old 14-Dec-2013, 5:31 AM   #40
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It turns out the co-channel interference I was worried about with KECI and K14IU-D never turned out to be any issue since K14IU-D is so much stronger. This really is do to I think a mess up by tvfool since I'm getting 100% signal with the UHF Antenna at only 20' above ground. I had to set it up this way since KECI was very weak and DISH recently lost carrier rights with KECI in Missoula. So My next issue is an actual adjacent channel issue that turns out only happens when there is an inversion or extreme cold IE 10 degree's or colder. The channels are KPAX-DT which is on real channel 7 but Virtual Channel 8.1 which in the right conditions is low enough in signal strength that it fights with K32EU which is actually broadcast on 7.1 real channel 8 (tvfool lists the virtual channel as 32.1 which is incorrect). Is there a way to block out K32EU? Or do I need to add a second AntennaCraft y10-7-13? If I need to add this second Antenna would I mount is next to the current or above/below the one I'm already using? One other question in regard to UHF antenna's, I've heard the bay style antenna's work better for 2Edge then Yagi? If this is true can anyone recommend which was to consider/avoid? I was considering the Solid Signal HDB8X or the Channel Master CM4228HD since the DB8 appears to work better for channels over 40 and my highest UHF channel is real channel 23.

Last edited by Damon459; 14-Dec-2013 at 5:33 AM. Reason: Was able to delete other post.
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