Help receiving CBS and ABC

[martinkopf]

Hi all,

I am having a difficult time picking up CBS and ABC which is on mount Soledad about 17 mies from me. I have a Spectrum 8 sp813 in my attic. I have tried many locations in my attic, on my patio, all around my house and get everything, except CBS and ABC edge2 stations? Any suggestions, I am new to OTA and have a new hobby!

Here is my tvfool report
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46ae31a4c17294

[GroundUrMast]

It's not uncommon to see small panel shaped antennas sold with claims of great gain, UHF/VHF & FM capability. The really bad ones also claim fantastic mileage, 100 or more miles.

Then the reality sets in. The basic antenna element is little better than the UHF loop on a rabbit ear style indoor antenna. I honestly don't know if that's the design used in the antenna you're using but your description strongly suggests that you have an antenna with modest UHF capability and little if any VHF performance.

If you/re committed to making an attic installation work, try an Antennacraft Y10713 (if it will fit and aim correctly). It's a large High-VHF antenna, designed to receive real channels 7 through 13. The two signals you're having a hard time with are broadcast on real CH-8 & CH-10 which a UHF antenna is not going to do well with.

If the Y10713 can't fit, then consider the Y5713. In either case the antenna needs to point west. The down-lead terminals are toward the rear of the antenna in this design.

You'll need to use a UHF/VHF signal combiner to merge the signal from your existing antenna with the new H-VHF antenna. The Radio Shack #15-2586 http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103923 is preferred in this case because it can pass power for the UHF antenna's amplifier circuit.

If we were neighbors, you'd see an Antennas Direct DB4e and an Antennacraft Y10713 on my roof.

[martinkopf]

Thanks for the help, exactly the advice I needed! I'll get an Antennacraft Y10713 and test it out. I'll let you know how it works out.

[martinkopf]

Ok, I went with the Y5713 that arrived today. I tested a few location on my patio with no luck, so went up in the attic and mounted it where my other antenna was, got CBS which is the big one I really needed since that is where the Chargers play and a lot of programming I watch is on. Still not picking up ABC though? Not a deal breaker like CBS was but would like to get it too. Just using the Y5713 I get everything I need and then some! Any recommendations on picking up ABC? I am very pleased getting CBS and with the Y5713 recommend!

[martinkopf]

Okay, it detects ABC 10.1 & 10.2 now but no signal. When watching diags on 10.1 it goes to 70 % with an SNR (DB) of 12, then drops to 18% with an SNR of 10378. It's windy today, could it be a tree blowing in the wind? Now that I have 10.1 detected, what is the best way to troubleshoot this, move the antenna around in my attic until the I get reception?

[martinkopf]

Or should I go with the Y10713? My attic is huge so a 10' boom will not be an issue.

[GroundUrMast]

Attics and trees.... YUK!

The Y10713 would be my choice, outside, clear of obstructions.

[martinkopf]

Yeah my HOA won't allow a roof install, and I'd prefer not installing it on my patio so the attic is my best option. I'm close, pick up 29 channels, including CBS now, all crystal clear with the Y5713. Do you think I would be able to get ABC with the Y10713, or anything else I could try?

[No static at all]

Yeah my HOA won't allow a roof installThey want you to think that, but it is just not true. Read here (http://www.fcc.gov/guides/installing-consumer-owned-antennas-and-satellite-dishes).

These are the same idiots that won't allow a friggin clothesline in the back yard, so that just shows how ignorant they are!!

[Stereocraig]

They want you to think that, but it is just not true. Read here (http://www.fcc.gov/guides/installing-consumer-owned-antennas-and-satellite-dishes).

These are the same idiots that won't allow a friggin clothesline in the back yard, so that just shows how ignorant they are!!


My experience, has been that they are not ignorant, they are just hoping that you are:)

[martinkopf]

I have the Y10713 arriving today in hopes of picking up ABC. Could I combine the Y5713 and the Y10713 to make a stronger signal?

[Stereocraig]

I have the Y10713 arriving today in hopes of picking up ABC. Could I combine the Y5713 and the Y10713 to make a stronger signal?

Antennas for the same band, should be identical, if aiming in the same direction.
Even then, I believe that the amount you gain, would be somewhat offset by combiner losses.
If it

[GroundUrMast]

It's practical to consider combining two identical antennas. If you do decide to attempt a stacked pair of H-VHF antennas, this may be helpful information: http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=1024

Long before I attempted a stacked pair of H-VHF antennas, I would 'test' reception outdoors. I would even go so far as to try the full 12' above the peak of my roof (specifically protected from HOA and local code enforcement by the FCC OTARD rules).

[martinkopf]

Okay, bought an in-line amplifier from Radio Shack and ABC comes in now, for about 15 minutes, then becomes pixelated and then signal loss for about 10 minutes, then comes back in for 15 minutes? I see it at 82% when working, then drops to 38% when the issue starts. Anything I can do to help the signal strength?

[ADTech]

Slapping a substandard amp on an antenna will rarely give good results. You really need to 1) Use the right antenna, 2) Put it where it needs to be, then 3) Adjust it properly.

[martinkopf]

Thanks, what antenna would you suggest? The Y10-7-13 I thought would handle my needs? I do prefer to keep it in my attic. You don't think any type of amp/preamp will resolve my issue?

[martinkopf]

The in-line amp did make the difference of receiving ABC at all? I think it's 12DB

[martinkopf]

I am getting CBS at 91% since the in-line amp and ABC is in the same location. I contacted the engineering dept from ABC, very cooperative BTW and he suggested a low noise amplifier, which is why I tried in the first place. I have tried every location in my attic and feel I have it in the sweet spot since I am receiving 30 channels with the Y10-7-13. If I need a better antenna, then that's what I'll get, money is not an option. I want ABC too!

[GroundUrMast]

Thanks, what antenna would you suggest? The Y10-7-13 I thought would handle my needs? I do prefer to keep it in my attic. You don't think any type of amp/preamp will resolve my issue?
No amplifier will make any antenna work better. The job of an amplifier is to overcome loss caused by coax and splitters. If the antenna is not receiving a reliable signal due to an obstruction between it and the transmitter, an amplifier is not going to amplify just the desirable signal, it will also amplify the noise and distortion, then add a bit more noise and distortion of it's own. What you get at the TV is stronger noise and distortion with some desirable signal mixed in.

The Y10713 is designed to receive real channels 7 through 13. I'm not aware of a better option until you step up to commercial grade products such as Wade. I doubt you need to spend that kind of money, and if you put a Wade antenna in your attic, it may well perform just as the Y10713 is now.

It's time to 'test' reception outside, clear of the impairments caused by the attic and roof. http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=13646 As I said earlier, "If we were neighbors, you'd see an Antennas Direct DB4e and an Antennacraft Y10713 on my roof."

[GroundUrMast]

Another analogy -

If there is nothing but a little muddy water in the bottom of a hole, you may choose to call it a 'well' if you like. Installing a big powerful pump will not make the 'well' produce clean water though.

(Hence my signature...)

[martinkopf]

Hmm, strange. It is definitely helping in my situation? Without the in-line amplifer, I run a scan and cannot pickup ABC, doesn't even detect or add as an available channel at all. This is the same on 3 different TV's. With the amplifer it picks up ABC, adds as an available channel and comes in nicely for a little while. Also CBS is 86-87% without the amp and 91-92% solid with the amp, as well as some other channels that were in the 90's are coming in at 100% now. So what does it mean if it without doubt is helping pickup and strengthening signals?