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Old 22-Feb-2013, 4:42 PM   #1
bailee
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Antenna Choice, Exisiting Cables, Grounding Wire

I presently have cable, internet and land line phone. Am trying to get an alternate plan in place in case I loose my job. In that scenario, I would want to drop cable tv, keep the internet and possibly the land line phone.

I plan to use the instructions given elsewhere on this site, that describes connecting the antenna to the existing cable wiring/ports. I will NOT do this until deactivating the cable tv. I understand the ports to the TVs have to be connected to the antenna and that the incoming line has to be attached to the internet and landline ports. Since my situation is slightly different than the other (he didnít have landline phone), do I connect a splitter in the cable box.. incoming line splitting to internet and land line ports? (I donít have a tool to access the cable box yetÖso donít have a clear picture of what is connected to what presently.) (1) If so, what kind of splitter or part do I need to get? I may be worrying about nothing as I suppose the cable company may come out to do that when I say that I am dropping cable?

Secondly, here is my reception report. http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...1ddae1d4354214

I have 5 TVs, but rarely using more than 2 at a time. I live in a HOA neighborhood and our Oklahoma weather is often windy. I was thinking of installing in the attic: the RCA ant751R, with rca tvpramp1r, using media bridge coaxial digital audio video cable, and some cable clips.

I think the cables are presently attached to a booster in the attic, not sure if that is for the TV or the internet. There are big circular ďaluminum coveredĒ ducts hanging from the rafters, but I donít think there are any obstructing the northward antenna direction.

2. If itís questionable, I would rather get the ďextra.Ē Do you think I need the amp or a different one?

3. I donít want to install on the roof/or outside unless it is absolutely necessary and the antenna is no bigger than a small satellite dish. Is the RCA 751r in the attic appropriate for my situation? Or a different one?

4. It looks to me like there is a grounding wire coming out of the exterior cable box. Not having access to the cable box at this writing, would that be appropriate for grounding the antenna, or would it likely only apply for incoming line connected to internet and land line ports? Would I still need to run additional grounding wire for antenna?

5. Do you have other suggestions/parts that I need to buy in order to complete the task?

Thanks in advance for your time. Sorry for the length.
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Old 22-Feb-2013, 8:55 PM   #2
GroundUrMast
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If you can get reliable reception of all the signals you desire with an attic mounted antenna, great, the antenna will last indefinitely, protected from the weather. However, attics can cause reception trouble, particularly if there's metal close to the antenna. If you try the installation in the attic and find unacceptable performance, the FCC protects your right to install outdoors, over-riding HOA rules. http://www.fcc.gov/guides/over-air-r...n-devices-rule

The ANT-751R is a very good fit in your case. I would avoid the TVPRAMP1R. If an amplifier proves necessary, the booster in the attic may be appropriate... what is the make and model of the booster?

Do all cables from the TVs run into the cable box? Or, does one coax come out of the box to a splitter?

The rest of your concerns are important but let's work on understanding your existing cabling arrangement so we can keep you from mixing cable company signal (phone/internet) with OTA. Then the answers to the rest of your questions will come in to focus.
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Old 23-Feb-2013, 12:28 AM   #3
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Attics Are Not a reception friendly environment and Never Will Be a reception friendly environment.
Signal attenuation and signal reflections/multipath bouncing around in the attic.

If the attic has metal backed insulation , the signal will be attenuated and reflected.

If the house has a metal roof the signal will be attenuated and reflected.

Start with a ANT751 antenna in the attic aimed at about 10 degree magnetic compass direction.

Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

If bad reception situations are not resolvable by adjusting the aim or location of the ANT751 antenna in the attic then move the ANT751 antenna to above the outside peak of the roof.

You own the coaxes that are in or on your home and can use the coaxes to distribute Broadcast Tv Antenna ANT751 Digital Tv stations/channels through out your house.

The coax that has the cable internet/phone service , cannot be connected to the coaxes that are used for the antenna system.

The Digital Tv transmissions are Strong Signal Strength at your location and a signal amplifier/booster will most likely not be required.

I recommend use a simple common passive splitter , not the distribution amplifier.

However , what is the make and model number of the booster.

__________

As always , trees and tree leaves do a good job of , multipath/reflecting , absorbing , blocking , Digital Broadcast Tv reception and so do buildings and other obstructions including your own roof and house.

It is best install the ANT751 at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions of any type or kind in the directions of reception including your own roof and house.

The Tv's Must channel scan for the , OTA= Over The Air , Digital Broadcast Tv Channels , often named the 'Air Channels' or 'Antenna Channels' in the Tv Setup Menu because the Tv transmissions travel through the Air from the transmitting antenna to the receiving antenna.

Some Digital Tv's will automatic channel scan for cable tv channels.

DO NOT channel scan for cable tv channels.

Go into the Tv Setup Menu and select , 'Air Channels' / 'Antenna Channels'.

Last edited by teleview; 26-Feb-2013 at 5:39 PM.
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Old 26-Feb-2013, 4:23 PM   #4
bailee
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Thank you for the two responses and here is more info. I apologize in advance that I may have used the wrong terminology in my original post when referring to the booster. Not sure.

1. No aluminum backed insulation. Single layer of asphalt shingles on roof of wood framed brick house. I don't think the brick is in front of the antenna direction but off to the side.

2. In the Attic: Antronix ara4-7B1 bypass amplifier which is connected to a 3 way splitter SV-3G 5-10000 mhz. In one of my downstairs bedrooms with a Tv, is a "power supply" ? that says SVPI model # LF 12200D-08 . It is plugged into the outlet. There is a green band on the cable coming out of the wall and attached to a splitter, one cable is attached to SVPI and the other cable goes to the TV. I noticed this same green band on a cable coming out of one of the ports of the Antronix in the attic.

I also saw two different wires running to various places in the attic, their colors green and blue, they were not connected to the amplifier or splitter. (Wondered if they were related to the phone?)

Again, thank you. I know it takes a lot of time answering all these questions.
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Old 26-Feb-2013, 5:14 PM   #5
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The Antronix ara4-7B1 would be a better amplifier than the RCA TVPRAMP1R. It has a decent noise figure and the ability to handle a lot of strong signals without overloading. http://www.antronix.net/uploads/spec...A4-7B_61_0.pdf

Because you are going to keep your coax based internet and phone service active, you'll need to trace the cabling. Start at the internet modem. Does it have a phone cord connected to a wall jack? Traditional phone wire is one or more pairs of wire, not coax cable. When the cable company started competing with the traditional phone company, they commonly delivered phone service through a phone jack built into the internet modem. They then used a standard modular phone mounting cord to connect the dial-tone service from their modem to an existing phone jack and the existing phone wiring. But in some cases, the cable service may break-out the dial-tone with equipment mounted on the outside of the home... Regardless of which way your service is wired, you need to know which coax runs from the cable company's network to the internet modem so you can leave it connected to the cable company while disconnecting the rest of the coax cable in the house (for re-use in your separate antenna system). Be sure the cable company coax is not interconnected to your cabling that is fed from an antenna.

Tracing out each coax may be challenging if you can't follow it from end to end, but you should be able to easily figure it all out by disconnecting one cable at a time from the splitter(s), then confirming which TV or modem looses service. Take the time to confirm that only one TV or modem is affected, there may be more than one splitter in the existing system. Tag or label each cable as you go, putting every connection back the way you found it, careful to disconnect only one connection at a time.

Once you've done the tracing and labeling, you'll be able to know which coaxes can be disconnected from the cable company system and reused in your totally separate antenna system. I expect that you'll be able to reuse the Antronix amplifier and passive splitters, the cable internet modem won't need either if it's the only devise to remain connected to the cable company service.
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Old 26-Feb-2013, 5:59 PM   #6
bailee
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ground wire

Thank you for that helpful process and feedback.

Are you able to answer or address the #4 question in my original post...the need for an additional grounding wire... or the present one will do for the antenna?
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Old 26-Feb-2013, 7:32 PM   #7
GroundUrMast
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Best practice is to ground your antenna system regardless of whether it mounts in the attic or outside.

The grounding of the existing cable service connection should not be shared, you want both the signals and grounding to be separate from your antenna system. Fault current may never happen, but if it does, you don't want that current to flow from the cable company into your antenna system or vise-verse.

Take a look at these resources:
http://ecmweb.com/code-basics/articl...sion-equipment
http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=901

Last edited by GroundUrMast; 26-Feb-2013 at 7:35 PM. Reason: sp.
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Old 8-Mar-2013, 5:25 PM   #8
bailee
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outlet screw, electrical wiring as an antenna

I havent purchased the RCA ant751 yet, I ran across this You Tube video which shows, attaching coaxial to outlet plate/screw, so that the electrical wiring serves as an antenna.

May I ask what your opinion of this is? Does it work? Harmful to digital TVs?
Risky during lightening more so than cable or antenna? What do you think are my chances considering I am 20 miles from stations?

http://youtu.be/huaNWZQL6Nw
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Old 8-Mar-2013, 5:29 PM   #9
bailee
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I havent purchased the RCA ant751 yet, I ran across this You Tube video which shows, attaching coaxial to outlet plate/screw, so that the electrical wiring serves as an antenna.

May I ask what your opinion of this is? Does it work? Harmful to digital TVs? Risky during storms or lightening, more so than cable or antenna? If it does work, what do you think are my chances of receiving stations 20 miles away?


http://youtu.be/huaNWZQL6Nw
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Old 8-Mar-2013, 8:27 PM   #10
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You would be better off trying an inexpensive rabbit-ear style indoor antenna.

The problem with using your power line wiring as an antenna is that you typically have many other noise generating devises attached to the power system, you would be inviting all that interference to have it's way with the reliability of reception. Then, if there is a fault that causes current in the ground conductor of the home wiring, there may be voltage present on the switch cover screws... how much voltage depends on the impedance of the grounding conductor and the magnitude of the fault current. So, there would be some small chance of damage to your TV.

As an aside, the experience of the YT post demonstrates that the power line ground is rarely if ever an effective RF ground.

In the end, I'll stick with the recommendation teleview and I offered early on in this thread.
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