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Old 5-Oct-2012, 4:33 PM   #1
thxtheater
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Join Date: Oct 2012
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Stumped: Unable to get FOX from Hartford or NYC

Greetings all!

Like many of you, I've been wanting to cut reliance on Cable and get better uncompressed HD reception. I'm all set except for one problem: I cannot get the FOX channels from either Hartford or New York even though, according to all the data, I should be. So I'm asking for help and insight as to why I'm not getting the Fox channels (61.1 and 5.1).

Even more perplexing, I called the FOX station in Hartford (they were very helpful) and they asked me if I get channel 20.1.... I said, "Yes" and they told me that it's very odd since the 20.1 and their 61.1 are on exactly the same transmitter! So if I'm getting one then I should be getting the other?! I also tried the non-virtual channel (31.1-31.3) and still get nothing. I also tuned my TV to 61.1 and 31.3 and rotated the antenna 360 degrees and got no signal. So why I'm getting 20.1 and not 61.1 is a mystery! The same with 5.1; according to the graph, I should have no issue.

So, if you look at my graphs, I should be getting both NYC and Hartford. I need some serious help as I'm totally baffled. I've stumped the FOX engineer and I've stumped the folks at SolidSignal, where I got my antennas.

I'm located just outside New Haven, CT. My antenna is about 20-30 feet up on the side of my house and my setup is as follows:

1) Winegard HD8200U Directional Antenna
2) Winegard AP8700 Chromstar 2000 series VHF/UHF preamp
3) RCA VH126N Antenna Rotator
4) My TV is an older Sony 52" LCD. I don't know what tuner it has
5) I have a secondary 47" Samsung plasma that I purchased from Sam's Club last year that I could also connect my antenna to.
6) In terms of cabling, I'm using a 100 foot RG6 cable from RadioShack and then coming into the house I have MonoPrice quad shield solid copper.

ADDITIONAL: I also have a Winegard MS2000 Metrostar omnidirectional antenna. I had this before the Winegard HD8200U and still didn't get the FOX channels. I've also used both together and joined the signals post amplification as recommended and still no luck! I've tried both with and without the MS2000 and still don't get either FOX channel.

I've provided the map that I'm getting from my location below. I have absolutely no idea what more to do to debug this and I'm looking to the community for some help and insights!!!

The only other thing that the engineer suggested was trying another tuner. I connected the antenna to a Samsung Plasma in another part of my house and still no luck (I actually got less channels with the Samsung than I did with the Sony)

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...2df90fd1575bf0

Last edited by thxtheater; 5-Oct-2012 at 5:17 PM. Reason: Adding another debugging thing I did
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Old 5-Oct-2012, 5:31 PM   #2
teleview
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Disconnect and remove the , preamp , the preamp power supply , the preamp power injector.

Disconnect and remove the MS2000.

Make sure the phasing lines of the HD8200U are connected correctly and not touching the boom as shown at http://www.winegarddirect.com.

Aim the HD8200U antenna at about 246 degree magnetic compass direction , WNYW UHF channel 44 FOX.

Connect a New long coax directly to HD8200U antenna and run the coax through a open window or door , directly to the New Plasma Tv.

Before connecting the One Long Coax that comes from the HD8200U antenna , remove any coax that is connected to the antenna connection on the Tv.

Digital Channels can develop , Digital Glitches.

Simply re scanning will often times not remove the Digital Glitches.

With No coax connected the Tv , You will do what is called a Double Rescan.

With No antenna connected to the Tv , Scan for Digital Broadcast Tv Channels , do not scan for cable Tv channels.

With No antenna connected to the Tv this , Clears Out , the tuner for a fresh scan for channels.

Now connect the antenna coax to the Tv and scan for channels.

Is WNYW Fox received now??

Last edited by teleview; 10-Oct-2012 at 2:06 AM.
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Old 5-Oct-2012, 5:59 PM   #3
thxtheater
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Posts: 4
That's fascinating! I had no idea about the double scan. In addition to doing complete scans, I've only recently started selecting the "add digital channels" option so that I don't rescan everything every time. I will certainly try that. Now, my SONY TV seems to have a better tuner (it was a more expensive set) than the Samsun Plasma (it was a $450 set). Does it make a difference???

I will absolutely double-check the phasing lines. Last I checked, they were not touching, but you never know!!!

Regarding the orientation, I've been using 20.1 as my compass since they told me it's the same tower. What I haven't done is orient 0 degrees on the antenna using my iPhone for true North. So right now i'm 50 degrees off, but I know, obviously, to compensate with simple math.

Now an additional question--if I leave the TV "tuned" to 61.1 and then rotate the antenna after all this, won't it pickup the channel or not necessarily???

Thanks a TON for this advice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teleview View Post
Disconnect and remove the , preamp , the preamp power supply , the preamp power injector.

Disconnect and remove the MS2000.

Make sure the phasing lines of the HD8200U are connected correctly and not touching the boom as shown at http://www.winegarddirect.com.

Aim the HD8200U antenna at about 246 degree magnetic compass direction , WNYW UHF channel 44 FOX.

Connect a New long coax directly to HD8200U antenna and run the coax through a open window or door , directly to the New Plasma Tv.

Before connecting the One Long Coax that comes from the HD8200U antenna , remove any coax that is connected to the antenna connection on the Tv.

Digital Channels and develop , Digital Glitches.

Simply re scanning will often times not remove the Digital Glitches.

With No coax connected the Tv , You will do what is called a Double Rescan.

With No antenna connected to the Tv , Scan for Digital Broadcast Tv Channels , do not scan for cable Tv channels.

With No antenna connected to the Tv this , Clears Out , the tuner for a fresh scan for channels.

Now connect the antenna coax to the Tv and scan for channels.

If WNYW Fox received now??
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Old 5-Oct-2012, 8:47 PM   #4
teleview
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Quote , "My TV is an older Sony 52" LCD".

That is why I suggested the newer Palsma Tv.

And yes can do the double rescan on both Tv's.

Also the phasing lines are in the matching transformer housing , make sure they are in there correctly and the connections of the matching transformer part of in the housing are making connections with the phasing lines.

Antenna aiming is not supper critical as to getting antenna right on the money as to degrees magnetic compass direction.

As always , the starting aim direction is the -> starting aim direction.

Then the antenna can be turned left and right to find a position that has the best reception.

Do not get your self all twisted up and tangled up with this idea and that idea and some other idea and lose track of what it is you are doing.

What you are doing is , Aim the HD8200U antenna at about 246 degrees magnetic compass direction.

Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

Connect a NEW long coax to the HD8200U antenna and run the NEW long coax through a open door or window direct to the Tv location , do not connect the New long coax to the Tv , remove any and all coaxes that are connected to the Tv and the antenna connection of the Tv.

Scan for Digital Broadcast Tv Channels to clear out the tuner , No antenna connected.

Connect the New long antenna connected coax to the antenna input connection of the the Tv and scan for Digital Broadcast Tv Channels.

What is reception of WNYW FOX like now??

_____________________

As always , trees and tree leaves do a real fine job of reducing or blocking Tv reception and so do buildings and other obstructions including your own house.

It is best install the antenna at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions of any type or kind in the directions of reception.

Quote , "My antenna is about 20-30 feet up on the side of my house".

The antenna Must Be mounted in such a manner the house Is Not obstructing the reception of Tv transmissions to the , north west , west , south , south east , east , north east.

Last edited by teleview; 19-Oct-2012 at 3:26 PM.
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Old 5-Oct-2012, 8:56 PM   #5
thxtheater
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 4
I have the antenna rotator....

I have the antenna rotator connected, so it's easy for me to use that to do the aiming.... I'm assuming that I'm still going from the ANTENNA-->PREAMP0--->TV, correct? My Winegard is an amplified antenna and, as I understand it, needs the preamp.


Quote:
Originally Posted by teleview View Post
Quote , "My TV is an older Sony 52" LCD".

That is why I suggested the newer Palsma Tv.

And yes can do the double rescan on both Tv's.

Also the phasing lines are in the matching transformer housing , make sure they are in there correctly and the connections of the matching transformer part of in the housing are making connections with the phasing lines.

Antenna aiming is not supper critical as to getting antenna right on the money as to degrees magnetic compass direction.

As always , the starting aim direction is the -> starting aim direction.

Then the antenna can be turned let and right to find a position that has the best reception.

Do not get your self all twisted up and tangled up with this idea and that idea and some other idea and lose track of what it is you are doing.

What you are doing is , Aim the HD8200U antenna at about 246 degrees magnetic compass direction.

Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

Connect a NEW long coax to the HD8200U antenna and run the NEW long coax through a open door or window direct to the Tv , do not connect the New long coax to the Tv , remove any and all coaxes that are connected to the Tv.

Scan for Digital Broadcast Tv Channels to clear out the tuner , No antenna connected.

Connect the New long antenna connected coax to the antenna input connection of the the Tv and scan for Digital Broadcast Tv Channels.

What is reception of WNYW FOX like now??
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Old 5-Oct-2012, 9:09 PM   #6
teleview
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As I stated before , remove ALL parts and pieces of the preamp , remove the preamp , remove the preamp power injector , remove the the preamp power supply , and any and all other parts and pieces of the preamp.

The preamp Will Not be connected in any way shape or form.

There will be No couplers or splitters , nothing.
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Old 6-Oct-2012, 3:01 PM   #7
tuffones
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Location: Oak Ridge, NC
Posts: 25
I m in Orange CT getting 5 and 5.1 from New York tower (Empire State) with HD7697p and cpa19 preamp like teleview and goundmast recomended. My friend in the next house got the 91xg & Y5713 combo with the cpa19 preamp pointing New York tower too. We got 80% signal strong!! We dont point Hartford towers, too many hills and trees, we got the Long Island channels strong too.
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Old 6-Oct-2012, 3:22 PM   #8
teleview
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To make a Point.

Just because some one at - A Location - receives channels , X , Y , Z , does not mean that some one at a -> Different Location <- will receive the same , X , Y , Z , .
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Old 14-Oct-2012, 11:53 PM   #9
thxtheater
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Success!!!!!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by teleview View Post
To make a Point.

Just because some one at - A Location - receives channels , X , Y , Z , does not mean that some one at a -> Different Location <- will receive the same , X , Y , Z , .
Thanks to everyone for the help. I finally had a non-rain day to get up on the roof and take a look at the antenna. One of the phasing lines was just touching one of the bolts on the antenna. So even though I was neurotic about making sure that the phasing lines weren't touching, sure enough, it was.

So I then properly set the antenna to true North and calibrated the rotator so that all degrees would properly correspond.

Then, all I did was rescan for additional digital channels and I got 7 new channels--among them FOX out of NYC (5.1).

Now I have everything I need to finally dump Cable!!! Thanks a ton everyone for your input and help. I can't thank you all enough.
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