reception problems after installation

clemmima · 15-Apr-2013, 5:45 PM

I had another thread on here but it was getting a bit long. Here is my report:
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...1dda3f0182c29a
I ran other reports, but it doesn't seem to matter much how low or high the antenna is.
I installed an HD7698P on a chimney mount at the peak of my roof and pointed it at 40 degrees. It's on new coax connected directly to one TV with one splice to add on a bit more coax. I got channels 6 and 49(which is 30-KPDX) and 2 intermittently. I am not using my original cable coax because I am using it for the internet.
So I turned it a series of 5 degrees and the best I got was 6, 32, and 49(30) and 12-but it was poor and dropped and I lost 2 completely. If I move the antenna even 2 inches, it makes a difference in getting a channel or not.
I have it running directly to one TV. When it is split, I lose the signal. I put on a Winegard HDP-269 preamp but I lost all signal. So I returned it and purchased a RCA TVPRAMP1R. When I put that on I also lost the signal even when it went directly to the TV without splitting it. So it I'm assuming it's not the preamps but something that is happening when I connect it.
So-I am clueless. It seems to me that there might be something loose at the box that is on the antenna that causes my signal to disappear. Everytime I disconnect and connect something I lose the signal and I have to wiggle things around a bit to get the signal back. Maybe when I'm attaching the preamp something's not quite connected good or something is not quite right on the antenna. I'm assuming that with the preamp I shouldn't lose the signal completely. Is there something that's touchy about the 7698P? Could it be a faulty antenna or it's connections? I hate to try to send it back because it is so large, but I'm about ready to just purchase a series of different antennas to see if something else works better. I don't know much about this whole thing, but when I look at my report, I think that I should be getting 8, 10, 12 before the ones that I am getting.
Any thoughts, ideas, suggestions, or maybe even suggestions on a different antenna?

rabbit73 · 15-Apr-2013, 6:37 PM

Quote:

Everytime I disconnect and connect something I lose the signal and I have to wiggle things around a bit to get the signal back.

Winegard has a video about troubleshooting the phasing lines for that series of antennas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlQke5QYbng

Quote:

I put on a Winegard HDP-269 preamp but I lost all signal.

Where did you put the preamp, at the antenna or inside?

Quote:

If I move the antenna even 2 inches, it makes a difference in getting a channel or not.

That antenna has the highest gain in that series, so it has the narrowest horizontal beamwidth.

Quote:

When it is split, I lose the signal.

When you split, you lose 3.5 dB.

Quote:

When I put that on I also lost the signal even when it went directly to the TV without splitting it. So it I'm assuming it's not the preamps but something that is happening when I connect it.

Was the preamp getting power from the power supply/power inserter?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNPb1XNBQSI

clemmima · 15-Apr-2013, 8:29 PM

Thank you for the troubleshooting videos. I will look for some more videos also. I put the preamp on the mast and the power suppy inside, hooked it up to the coax then to the TV. My feeling is that there is something going on with that box on the antenna(sorry don't know what it's called). I have lost signal, then opened it up, wiggled things, and gotten the signal back. So I'm going to try the troubleshooting before I send it back. Maybe just getting another "box" will do it and I won't have to send the antenna back.
I guess what I'm really wanting to know is--when looking at my report and with the antenna that I have, should I be getting more stations? I hate to keep trouble shooting if this is really the extent of what I can get. Are there any other antennas that I should try, or is this the best for my situation? I noticed that you said it is highly directional. I can't quite understand why I get channel 6, but not 2, 8, 10 or 12 when the towers are right next to each other.

GroundUrMast · 15-Apr-2013, 10:13 PM

rabbit73 has given you a great place to start... the symptoms you've described clearly call into question the assembly of the antenna. If there's a loose or open connection, or a short between the phasing lines and the boom you can expect erratic performance that kills some channels while still offering some reception on others. If not assembled correctly, the High-VHF section of the antenna may be partially of fully disconnected... That coincides with the majority of the real channels you've listed. (Virtual channels tend to confuse the conversation here... The antenna has no awareness of virtual channels, just the real channel numbers count when discussing the antenna system.)

To simplify even further, I would eliminate the preamp from the system during the initial trouble shooting of the antenna. I would simply use a single piece of coax from the antenna to a single TV that's known to have a good tuner set up for OTA signals (not cable). I would use the shortest length of coax that allows for safe and practical connection of the test TV. If you have 50' or less coax, the antenna should be able to drive it without a preamp being needed.

Only after you have established that the antenna is assembled and aimed correctly should you be concerned about the preamp... It's job is to overcome the losses caused by the coax and splitter.

15-Apr-2013, 10:28 PM

http://www.forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=13156.

As a Test to prove reception , disconnect the preamp (box thing) unit at the antenna , disconnect the power injector that supplies power to the preamp unit at the antenna , disconnect the power supply that is connected to the power injector that supplies power to the preamp unit at the antenna.

Connect a NEW long continuous length of coax to the antenna and run the NEW long continuous length of coax through a open door or open window , direct to 1 Tv.

A continuous length of coax , No potential trouble causing , couplers , splitters , etc. .

At your location , a minimum of these Tv stations should be received without an amplifier.

K18EL-D , Mynetwork.

KOPB-TV , PBS.

KGW , NBC.

KPXG-TV , ION.

KPDX-DT , MyNetwork.

KRCW-TV , CW.

KOIN-DT , CBS.

KATU-DT , ABC.

Stereocraig · 16-Apr-2013, 7:05 AM

I bought one of those a couple years ago and was really happy w/ it for a few months.

It started dropping out intermittently and was driving me nuts.
I started ohming out the 7-13 phasing lines and discovered that the rivet that goes through the boom to connect the phasing lines together all the way at the rear, was coming in contact w/ a chad that wasn't deburred completely.

Additionally, that is the worst excuse for a connection, that I have ever seen.
I hard wired mine, w/ #14 copper wire.

It's been doing fine, but I have been experimenting w/ other units and don't use it as much as I used to.

clemmima · 16-Apr-2013, 2:58 PM

My parents got the same antenna. They live a few miles away, but still have to contend with the two mountains between the Portland towers and their house. They will be having it put up on Sunday. That should give me some idea whether this model antenna should pull in more stations and have a stronger signal than it is giving me. If it does, then it would be another indication that it is the connections. It's driving me crazy.

GroundUrMast · 16-Apr-2013, 4:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teleview

http://www.forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=13156.

As a Test to prove reception...

Connect a NEW loooong coax to the antenna and run the NEW loooong coax through a open door or window , direct to 1 Tv.

...

It sounds like we have significantly different approaches to this type of testing. I don't want to read more into your use of the word 'loooong', but it seems that that term would very likely encourage adding loss to the test setup which would obscure the results... That is, if a signal was not received reliably during the test, one would be left questioning if it was a level problem caused by the added cable attenuation or antenna performance. If I'm not reading this correctly my apologies.

clemmima · 16-Apr-2013, 4:44 PM

Thanks for the reply. I really appreciate the list of stations that I should be getting so I know to keep troubleshooting. The preamp is completely disconnected and off the mast and the power unit is disconnected. I did run a cable straight over the roof to the TV but it was not new. The one I laid under the house was new though. I will get a new test cable. The "box thing" that I was talking about is the box that is connected directly to the antenna that the phasing lines go through.

<<<<<<As a Test to prove reception , disconnect the preamp (box thing) unit at the antenna , disconnect the power injector that supplies power to the preamp unit at the antenna , disconnect the power supply that is connected to the power injector that supplies power to the preamp unit at the antenna.

At your location , a minimum of these Tv stations should be received without an amplifier.

K18EL-D

KOPB-TV , PBS.

KGW , NBC.

KPXG-TV , ION.

KPDX-DT , MyNetwork.

KRCW-TV , CW.

KOIN-DT , CBS.

KATU-DT , ABC.[/QUOTE]

clemmima · 16-Apr-2013, 4:51 PM

One other thing. For the tests I am connecting this directly to a plasma 42" Insignia TV(Best Buy). I have a 32" Samsung LCD in another room. Would I be better off connecting it to the Samsung. Does it have a better tuner?

16-Apr-2013, 7:19 PM

There is No significant difference.

The point is , one continuous length of coax , No potential trouble causing , couplers , splitters , etc. .

____________________________________________

Ok , 'that' box thing , the matching transformer (balun) is shown in the video , the connections on the inside need to be connected to the phasing/antenna wires on the inside of the box.

______________

Testing and testing , Yes connect to one Tv and then the other Tv.

rabbit73 · 16-Apr-2013, 7:56 PM

Mary:

Quote:

I guess what I'm really wanting to know is--when looking at my report and with the antenna that I have, should I be getting more stations?

Yes

Since you have a Winegard antenna, have you tried contacting them by phone or internet? They have several phone contact options:
800-788-4417
319-754-0761

http://www.winegard.com/about/contact.php

You might even get a chance to talk to their Master Tech Hans!

Quote:

Would I be better off connecting it to the Samsung. Does it have a better tuner?

The quality of the tuner can vary from brand to brand and within the same brand, even when they are functioning properly. I think it's worth the trouble to compare them during your tests. You should test each before and after an antenna/over the air (not cable) rescan.

Sometimes a double rescan is needed:

http://www.dtv.gov/rescan.html