Help please-ready to install soon

[oakleyhoma]

My radar plot: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...1dda681c90a0f3 It assumes 10 feet height, which is wrong but i didn't know how to find my exact location AND have the antenna height option.

I zeroed in on aerial photo to exactly where I want to put tripod and antenna. I have no existing antenna, amp, etc. The only channels I care about: reliable reception for ABC, PBS, NBC, Fox, CBS; any others are gravy. I want to serve 4 tv's: one in basement, one on first floor, 2 on second floor. I believe I can use my existing cable tv coax infrastructure, at least in part. Peak of my upper roof is about 30 feet. I'd use a 5 ft. tripod (maybe Ronard 911?), mounting it on my back porch roof. My house ground rod is directly below (actually 2-3 foot north) of that point. I can enter with coax from there too via an existing hole in siding (PVC pipe left from old propane furnace) - That pvc pipe hole enters to basement (close to a 110 outlet, in case I need distribution amp), then I hope to tap into existing coax infrastructure from previous cable tv to distribute to 2 of the Tv's. It's close to 13 feet from porch roof mount location to peak of upper roof; figure I need tripod and mast to total 15 feet - which would put it 30-32 feet above ground, just peeking above upper roof peak. Looks like channels I want are all green-yellow. Would I need to go to peak of roof, say 32 feet, to get them? No trees close by within 100 yards to south, SW, SE... maybe in 30 years, but not now. What antenna and mount? Will I need distribution amp?

There are groups of Digital Tv stations/channels in 2 directions , north/east and south.

North/East direction has NBC and CBS and PBS and Cw and Me-Tv.

The South direction has ABC and CBS and PBS and FOX and CW and Me-Tv.

To receive , NBC , CBS , ABC , will require antennas setup to receive both directions , north/east and south.

The antennas will be combined into 1 coax.

Above the peak of the roof so that the roof and house are not blocking reception to the north/east, install a AntennaCraft Y5-2-6 VHF low band antenna aimed at about 35 degree magnetic compass direction.

Also install a AntennaCraft Y5-7-13 VHF high band antenna aimed at about 35 degree magnetic compass direction.

Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

The 2 antennas are connected together with a HLSJ = VHF high band / VHF low band - Separator/Joiner.

Type the letters hlsj in the , http://www.solidsignal.com , search box.

The Y5-2-6 antenna is connected to the VHF low connection of the HLSJ.

The Y5-7-13 antenna is connected to the VHF high connection of the HLSJ.

(( WJHL-TV channel 11 CBS and Me-Tv will be received at the front of the Y5-7-13 antenna and WLOS channel 13 ABC is strong signal strength and will be received at the back of the Y5-7-13 antenna.))

The remaining connection of the HLSJ will be connected to the VHF connection of a UVSJ = UHF/VHF - Separator/Joiner.

Type the letters uvsj in the , http://www.solidsignal.com , search box.
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For reception of the South group of Digital Broadcast Tv stations/channels.

Install a Channel Master CM4228HD UHF antenna above the peak of the roof so the reception is not blocked by the roof and house in directions of , south/east , south , south/west.

The CM4228HD will be aimed at about 190 degree magnetic compass direction.

Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

The CM4228HD antenna will be connected to the UHF connection of the UVSJ.

And the remaining connection of the UVSJ will be connected a Channel Master CM3410 distribution amplifier or a CM3414 distribution amplifier.

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Install the , Y5-2-6 low band antenna on the bottom , the Y5-7-13 VHF high band antenna above Y5-2-6 and have CM4228HD on top.

Or install the CM4228HD on the bottom , the Y5-2-6 above and the Y5-7-13 on top.

Try to have about 3 feet separation between the 2 Y5 antennas and the CM4228HD can be close to either Y5 antenna.

________________________________________

As always , trees and tree leaves do a good job of , multipath/reflecting , absorbing , blocking , Digital broadcast Tv reception and so do buildings and other obstructions including your own roof and house.

It is best to install antennas at a location that has the least amount to no amount of any type or kind of obstructions in the directions of reception including your own roof and house.

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The Tv's Must Channel Scan for the , OTA= Over The Air , Digital Broadcast Tv stations/channels , often named the 'Air Channels' or 'Antenna Channels' in the Tv Setup Menu because the Tv transmissions travel through the Air from the transmitting antenna to the receiving antenna.

Some Digital Tv's will automatic channel scan for cable tv channels.

DO NOT channel scan for cable tv channels.

Go into the Tv Setup Menu and select , 'Air Channels' / 'Antenna Channels'.

[oakleyhoma]

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...1dda1852335b44 elevation was at 32 feet

I have no existing antenna, mount, amp, etc. The only channels I care about: reliable reception for ABC, PBS, NBC, Fox; consider CBS expendable. Anything else I might get appreciated. I'm hoping for one antenna vs. 2-3. Wondering if 5 foot Ronard #911 on back porch roof with mast 14 feet to get me to 31 feet. 31 feet is height of upper roof peak. Guess I'd have to guy that mast, never done that before. Are there alternatives e.g., taller tripod, that could work? I really like the location on porch roof: house ground and coaxial path to basement and distribution is right below this point. Also, porch roof is not steep, and faces east (sheltered from wind). Once reaching the peak, I'm in the clear from trees, etc.

Will I need to amplify? From basement coax entry to 2nd floor TV: rough guess of 43 feet to one; much less to the other 2nd floor TV.

I want to serve 4 tv's: one in basement, one on first floor, 2 on second floor. I'll do away with cable tv and use existing cable tv coaxial to distribute. What all do I need? Thanks

The 2 radar plot reports are different.

The first radar plot report is showing a poor reception situation at the 10 foot antenna height.

The second radar plot is showing the same location and Tv stations , however now the reception situation is , Much , much , much , Better , at the 32 foot antenna height.

I will make a antenna recommendation for the second radar plot report.


Here is a Tall tripod for the porch.http://www.ronard.com/Tripods%200703/4712.html.

And here is a eave antenna mount that might work for the house.
http://www.ronard.com/34424560.html , use the #4560.

The 10 foot antenna height report is , Poor Reception and Misery.

The 32 foot antenna height report is , Very Good Reception and Happiness.

For the 32 foot antenna height install 1 Winegard HD7696P antenna aimed at about 180 degree magnetic compass direction.

Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

Install a Channel Master CM3410 distribution amplifier or CM3414 distribution amplifier.

[oakleyhoma]

I appreciate the previous help and good news and I’d taken the antenna/amp/tripod suggestion to heart, have even spoken to solid signal and Ronard equipment. I would install no sooner than a month from now, after trees have leafed out here. But now is really when I could use some more help. I’d like to report the lengths of my TV drops. Also, I checked actual height of my (upper) roof and now know it’s more like 26’4” rather than 32’. So, I’d set the antenna at about 28 feet. My drop lengths:
TV1: from CM 3414 amp, 28 feet; total from antenna to TV maybe 58 feet.
TV2: 25 feet from amp, total of 55 feet from antenna.
TV3: 22 feet from amp, total of 52 feet.
TV4: 41 foot run from amp, total of 71 feet.

I’d like to report my lat/long (used for the plots below): 35.763338, -82.621017

A new plot run at 28 feet http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...1ddab9d386a6ff
.
Same plot, elevation now 23 feet http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...1dda5f5d320d30

In running the new plot at 28 feet, I went to tv fool>online tv maps>using coordinates. If anyone wants to do that with my lat/long it’s fine with me! I turned on aerial view (then you can see the proposed tripod location, on back porch roof). I turned transmitter lines on… and then noticed something I hadn’t previously: I think all the channels I might get (decent NM) and/or care about are in one or two clusters: 1) an arc South-southwest to south-southeast and 2) another cluster generally northeast (whether I’d receive is the question). The aerial view shows me that none of the channels in those clusters are blocked by my upper, main house roof: they all shoot straight in to the back porch location where I’d set the antenna. So, I played back and forth with two elevations: 28 feet (Ronard 10-foot tower #4712 with 10 foot mast, 3 feet of it in the tripod) and 23 feet (Ronard 5 foot tripod, #1011-15 with 8 foot mast, 6 feet of it in the tripod). The 4712 is $443 shipped and the 1011-15 is $161 shipped from Solid Signal. Fairly large difference. So I thought what is the difference in channel/network content for the money? Of the major networks (I’m assuming CBS is a goner) toggling back and forth on the aerial, it seems like at 28 feet I might have gotten NBC affiliate WYCW, Channel 62. At 23 feet that channel seems questionable, but I might still receive another NBC affiliate: WCYB. I really only care about having one NBC channel. I looked at other antennas e.g., the Winegard 8200U: but the gain at the NBC/major broadcast channels doesn’t seem to be much different, so the HD-7696P still looks good.

So I wonder, as an admitted novice, am I seeing anything here? I will install this spring: my wife is completely on board now. She said well, don’t cheap out; and I agree. But if I “temp/test” the Winegard at both elevations and don’t see many differences, and do receive at least one “NBC”… it makes me wonder. My wife said, but isn’t the big tower easier to maintain, climbable and all that? I said it’s just as easy or easier to stand on the roof beside a 5-foot tripod to check/adjust/remove the antenna as it is to climb a 10-foot tower, on a roof, hang on and check/adjust/remove the antenna while hanging on to the tower! The big tower would actually need a longer, heavier mast. So this is my quandry: big tripod/mast to get more elevation and get above the peak of the upper roof vs. smaller tripod/mast at lower elevation, that might actually be as good or “good enough” all things considered. I hope I’ve been clear. I’m all ears and thanks.

[oakleyhoma]

One additional note: there is a 180 foot cell phone tower (US Cellular) about 1/2 mile to my northwest-LOS. Can't seem to find an answer, would that matter at all?

The cell phone tower is not in the direction of any of the Tv stations to receive.

Mostly cell phone towers Do Not cause Tv reception problems.

The -->Only Way<-- to find out if the cell phone tower and services will be an issue with the Tv reception is to install the HD7696P antenna and see what happens.

[oakleyhoma]

Great, thanks teleview. If anyone is interested or has time, Im still looking for guidance on my post from 3 March. Trying to compare the difference between the two plots (23 & 28 feet) because I'm not sure going to 28 feet will change what channels I'd get very much. And it costs me about $300 more to go higher. The higher price is fine if that's what it takes to get at least most of my basic networks, but ... that is the question.

Do not install any lower then 28 feet.

Install the HD7696P antenna aimed to the south.

For outside coax , use the coax that has the compression type connectors on the ends of the coax.

Do not use the Old crimp type connectors on the ends of the coax.

-->Now is the time to For Action.<--

-->Yes it is Ok for you to start and complete the install.<--

[oakleyhoma]

Thanks very much. I'm grateful for your help and the resource this site provides. I'll use compression type. Should my RG6 be all copper or copper over steel (Lowes)? No need for quad shield right? No reason to wait a month for leaf-out to test for interference /multi-path?

I hope to temp it in like this: put concrete block on roof, add pipe, pour remainder of block with concrete, remove pipe piece when concrete won't slump. I'll end up with a slanted hole that's plumb to receive about a foot of a temporary mast. I'll test with that, if it goes well at 28 feet, I'll order the Ronard 4712 to go with 10 foot mast, 3 feet of which is in the tripod.

[oakleyhoma]

It seems most of the threads deal with posting radar plots, discussing antennas, and less often about mounting. Which is the appropriate forum for mounting and mast questions?

[GroundUrMast]

If you want to discuss your specific mounting issues, you're in the right forum.

Reliable reception starts with the antenna and it's placement. Both factors are equally important, but it seems that most folks do focus on the antenna. There are several more factors that can affect reception reliability, so 'Help with Reception' is appropriate for discussing specific reception situations. That includes selection of antenna, mounting, amplifier, cabling, splitters, tuner configuration, interference issues... and every thing else that may affect reception at a specific location.

The 'Special Topics' forum and it's sub-forums are geared toward discussions that are not specific to an individual location. This would be a good place to discuss the general features, merits & qualities of reception equipment and hardware.

[oakleyhoma]

I'll post back here soon with my particulars. I'll post a new radar plot too, but my main issue is getting the mounting part figured out.

[oakleyhoma]

Now I really need advice about mounting. A tech person at a company I called (not sure if it's ok to say which) basically said: "Yours is easy. Get a Rohn 9H50 34 foot telescoping antenna. The tech person said stick it a couple feet in the ground, etc. Comes in 5-foot sections. Raise it up the remaining 32 feet. Use a couple of Rohn wall mounts. If 14 feet of mast is not guyed (which would be the case) ... no problem. It'll do it."

What I need to know is do telescoping mounts work well? I've read they can get sticky, will pinch fingers, etc. And if they ever to get bent a bit -- harder and harder to work them. I need something that I can get to easily from the ground or at least from my 4-12 pitch back porch roof. Comments on telescoping masts I found seemed all over the map, with some negatives (hard to raise, stickiness, etc.) and I'd been looking into tilt-over options until he advised me the Rohn telescoping was a good, simple way to go. The mast plan is really what I need help with. I am really trying to stay away from mounts on my steep upper roof and also from penetrating my roof (new roof last year). I might have some options for guy wiring if that's what I'd have to do (well, at least I've figured where two could go). I'd rather not, but maybe I could.

Here's another radar plot, at 32 feet. It assumes 2 feet of Rohn mast in ground, 32 feet of mast in the air. Clears my 26 foot roof peak by 6 feet. The upper wall mount bracket would be in framing studs, at about 18 feet above ground. No trees or nearby obstructions anywhere near for all compass directions.
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...1dda3e1fe0c869

One other question: Winegard 7696P was recommended, about 11 lbs. I had said as long as I could reliably get most of the major broadcast networks, I'd be happy and so CBS was expendable. However, I'm curious what would it take to get WJHL (CBS), since it looks like they have a virtual channel 11.2 my kids would really benefit from. Thanks to everyone in advance... my main concern is about whether telescoping masts are decent stuff or to be avoided.

Finally (yes, I feel like a ping pong ball now) this is a response I just got from [a reputable company], after emailing to ask what on center spacing their Ronard 124 wall mount bracket had: "In the ground mast will effect the antennas ability to get the signal, your best bet is to use a rather large antenna outside on the roof. I recommend the Winegard HD 7697 antenna."

W09AR to the south , also has Me-Tv , http://www.rabbitears.info/market.ph...ility_id=66397.

Yes telescopic masts work Ok.

The antenna mounting method is All Your Choice.

Do not install the antenna any lower then 28 feet above ground.

It is Ok to take action.

It is Ok to start and complete the installation.

[oakleyhoma]

Thank you teleview. But I can't find W09JR ... is it perhaps W09AR? (right near me) http://www.rabbitears.info/market.ph...ility_id=66397

Still hung on the mount thing- if I thought a roof mount tripod would not/could not leak, I'd do that but new roof and all... Maybe a chimney mount is what I'll have to do, but we use our wood stove plenty. Wish I could figure a way to do a strong tilt mast, in solid blocking on my back porch roof, guyed at low angle from my chimney and ridge vent. Comments still welcome.

Does anyone know how to insert a .jpg here --- I'd like to provide a pic of my options. I can't seem to be able to paste one in.

[GroundUrMast]

With a roof peak at 26', I'd opt for a chimney mount or eave mount. Home Depot sells a 10.5' galvanized top rail, intended for chain link fence construction, but it serves very well as a mast. I would not want an antenna subject to wood smoke, but a 10' mast on a chimney mount solves that issue to my satisfaction. http://www.homedepot.com/p/t/1003225...2#.UUOAQzfxc4I I would expect a chimney mount kit and 10+ foot mast should net at least 7' clearance above the flue. And you get an installed height of more than 30' AGL

3StarInc offers many mounting hardware options... http://www.3starinc.com/roof_mounts.html

To add photos:
'Go Advanced', 'Manage Attachments' ...

Here are antenna mounts.

http://www.ronard.com/909911.html. If you choose tripod antenna mount use the 5 foot antenna mount.

http://www.ronard.com/Tripods%200703/4712.html. 10 foot tripod antenna mount.

http://www.ronard.com/34424560.html. If you choose the eave antenna mount , use the #4560 eave antenna mount.

http://www.ronard.com/ychim.html.

http://www.ronard.com.

Buy the ronard antenna mounts at , http://www.solidsignal.com , by typing the word ronard in the solidsignal search box or buy from ronard.

Here are , Aluminum , Light Weight , Free Standing , No Guy Wires , Lay Over Towers , Do All antenna mounting and adjustments , Standing on the Ground.

http://WWW.palcoelectronics.com/pe300.aspx.

You can also type the words , tv antenna mounts , in the google search box.

Do not install the HD7696P antenna any lower then 28 feet above ground.