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Old 27-Feb-2020, 12:28 AM   #1
mikmaze
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hand in better reception

rsults are here: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...9038762333d804

I am on a bit of a higher spot on my property, and would say my antenna is about 40 feet up. it is a big one from channel master, about 12 feet long. I run as short a coax as possible, ant is pointed towards most concentrated signals. Of course, I would like to get more reception. any good signal amps? should I go higher\? does not seem like I am that far from signal sources, but just not getting all that I think I should.

thanks for any and all help !
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Old 27-Feb-2020, 1:16 AM   #2
Tim
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Originally Posted by mikmaze View Post
rsults are here: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...9038762333d804

I am on a bit of a higher spot on my property, and would say my antenna is about 40 feet up. it is a big one from channel master, about 12 feet long. I run as short a coax as possible, ant is pointed towards most concentrated signals. Of course, I would like to get more reception. any good signal amps? should I go higher\? does not seem like I am that far from signal sources, but just not getting all that I think I should.

thanks for any and all help !
Wow! That's probably one of the worst signal reports I've seen posted. Which of the stations are you able to receive?

It would be helpful if you could also post a link to your RabbitEars signal report...there site is much more up-to-date than TV Fool.
https://www.rabbitears.info/searchmap.php
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Old 27-Feb-2020, 2:24 AM   #3
mikmaze
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yeah, figured I would find the worst spot.. this was with only 30 ant height, only just figured out setting new height. doesn't seem to help much unless you get crazy and are over 100 feet up!

. https://www.rabbitears.info/searchma...study_id=63955




.

Last edited by mikmaze; 27-Feb-2020 at 2:32 AM.
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Old 27-Feb-2020, 4:13 PM   #4
mikmaze
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and if you plug in 500 feet, now things start to happen, I will have to make a list next time up at the remote camp as I would only be guessing and miss most of what I get.
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Old 27-Feb-2020, 7:26 PM   #5
jrgagne99
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I think you have a decent shot at good reception. My report is worse than yours and I can reliably receive all 5 networks. Since you haven't specified which market you are after, I will assume Syracuse. That being said, I recommend throwing that 12-foot CM into the recycle bin. It undoubtedly has VHF-hi and VHF-lo elements that aren't needed, as all major Syracuse stations are on UHF. I recommend a DB8e or equivalent 8-bay (e.g. HDB8X) aimed at 327 magnetic. Or you could try a yagi like the HDB91X or equivalent. Start with a single, short length (<50 ft) of new, RG-6 coax and no preamp. Once you have determined the best antenna location and aim, then you can work on the distribution, which may require mast-mounted pre-amp or distribution amplifier.

P.S. What model CM do you have presently? Depending on its UHF gain, it could be used short term to sniff out the best antenna location and aim. It may even have comparable gain to the UHF-only antennas i suggest above, though likely a few dB less, in my experience.

Also, I recommend that you don't be wedded to any particular antenna location at this point in time. Differences of a foot or two in X, Y, and Z directions can make a huge difference in weak UHF signals. It took me almost 2 years to find my sweet spot up in a tree at the corner of my property (seach "Reception Help in NH" thread). That is why the UHF only antennas would be good--- they are smaller than that CM monster and would be easier for hunting for your sweet-spot.

Last edited by jrgagne99; 27-Feb-2020 at 7:32 PM.
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Old 27-Feb-2020, 8:46 PM   #6
mikmaze
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Syracuse is one of the target areas, I guess Utica would be next. probably a good bit of repeat networks, didn't look close at the table yet. Not tied to one antenna at all, honestly when I stated looking at antennas, I thought those flat jobbers looked like gimmicks. but hey, for 80 bucks, it is worth a shot. now as far as a rota-tor, or, combining the two? say what I have, and add the HDB8x? keep one pointed at Utica, the other at Syracuse? combine their signals in a box, then one lead to the tv?

seems like rota-tor is on the no list, but I'd need convinvcing why, I'm not dvr'ing anything, just trying to watch more, and better.

sooo, googled and I could combine two, or more for one signal as far as I read anyway. now onto this whole repack thing, how often should one do an automatic channel search to ensure I'm getting all that I can?

Last edited by mikmaze; 27-Feb-2020 at 9:14 PM.
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Old 28-Feb-2020, 1:35 AM   #7
Tim
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Originally Posted by mikmaze View Post
yeah, figured I would find the worst spot.. this was with only 30 ant height, only just figured out setting new height. doesn't seem to help much unless you get crazy and are over 100 feet up!

. https://www.rabbitears.info/searchma...study_id=63955

.
Yeah, your location shows you are behind some pretty good size hills...that will definitely cut down on the TV signal available. On your RabbitEars report you can click on the 'Transmitter Distance (Miles)' figure for each station and see what the terrain looks like between you and the transmitter. Here is an example for WSYT in Syracuse.
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Old 28-Feb-2020, 2:12 AM   #8
mikmaze
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yikes, some of the ones from Utica are serious line of site impared.........!
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Old 28-Feb-2020, 3:24 PM   #9
jrgagne99
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I suggest you focus on the signals at 325-ish degrees. They are the strongest ones in your report, all UHF, and if successful, will get you all the major networks. If you can't get CBS on WTVH (signal strength is 6 dB lower than the others), you have a chance at getting it from the south on WBNG. This is conveniently on VHF-hi so would be relatively easy to combine with the signals from your main UHF antenna. You would use a Stellar labs 30-2476 VHF-hi antenna for that one, but i would wait and see if you can get CBS on WTVH first. Combining UHF signals from different directions can be very tricky-- interference can easily result in fewer channels received.

You are in a deep fringe area. Start by seeing what you can get under the simplest conditions (a good UHF antenna, new short RG-6, one TV). Worry about multiple directions, rotors, and distribution LATER.
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Old 28-Feb-2020, 3:30 PM   #10
jrgagne99
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now onto this whole repack thing, how often should one do an automatic channel search to ensure I'm getting all that I can?
I believe rabbit ears has repack info for channel-specific reallocations. The FCC site has the repack schedule for each of the 10 phases. Currently in Phase 8. Phase 10 will be completed by 7/3/20. After that no rescan needed.
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Old 28-Feb-2020, 4:36 PM   #11
mikmaze
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Sounds good, appreciate all the help, ideas, suggestions so far. it might be a while before I get up there to get a list of channels. One good thing, my house is oriented almost due north making adjusting to an angle pretty easy even without a compass.
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Old 28-Feb-2020, 5:06 PM   #12
jrgagne99
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Don't forget to account for the magnetic declination in your aiming. Ultimately signal strength is the final arbiter. A TV with a signal strength meter, preferably a quantitative one, is very helpful.
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Old 28-Feb-2020, 9:15 PM   #13
mikmaze
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I had bought a signal meter two years ago, I'll have to find it for next round of aiming, switching/ and or replacing of the antenna.
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Old 29-Feb-2020, 1:47 AM   #14
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If I lived in your location I’d try a DB-4e UHF only aimed at Syracuse and the VHF only Stellar labs antenna aimed at Binghamton.

I like the DB-4e because the UHF stations in Syracuse are spread too far apart for an 8 bay or 91XG.

The best location for the UHF antenna and the VHF antenna will probably be two separate locations.

You will want a preamp. The TVPRAMP series has two inputs, one for UHF and one for VHF. That properly combines the two antennas with no worry as to the length of cable from each antenna to the preamp.
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Old 29-Feb-2020, 12:15 PM   #15
mikmaze
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I truly appreciate the help, that tvpramp unit seems to have a high failure rate, talk of low voltage from the power supply causing poor performance/ doa, or Dead within a month, lot of good talk about the channel master 7778HD, at 100 bux it is not cheap, but it is a long term cure I am looking for. Interesting getting differing ideas between the DB-4e and 8e. Again, the price doesn't bother me as I would rather do it just one more time instead of trying to do it on the cheaper side. true you can't just throw money at a problem and expect that to work, but cheaping ut ends many times in tossing that initial moeny away, and bringing new/ more money to the problem.

as a side note, if you think my tv reception map is bad, you should see my Verizon signal. I have a weboost setup that helps that end of the spectrum, and may upgrade the outside end of that with a yagi.
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Old 29-Feb-2020, 9:57 PM   #16
Tower Guy
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The Juice preamp would be good for you. Remember to get a UVSJ to properly combine the UHF and VHF antennas before the preamp.
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Old 2-Mar-2020, 1:58 PM   #17
jrgagne99
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IMO, the VHF antenna aimed at Binghamton is only warranted if you don't get the desired programming from Syracuse. For example if you want the local news broadcasts from Binghamton's. Otherwise, both FOX and CBS are broadcast out of Syracuse, so would be redundant, and not worth the extra antenna, IMO.


As far as the beamwidth of the dB8e being too narrow to capture all of the Syracuse stations, I think I would be more worried about the db4e not having enough gain. It will certainly be a trade-off and be interesting to see the results. Please keep us posted!!! I think I would use the cheaper HDB8X or HDB4x to do my trials, as their performance is very close to the dB8e/4e, in my experience.
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Old 2-Mar-2020, 2:06 PM   #18
mikmaze
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the 4 vs 8 series seems like a no brainer, more is more, and signal is what I am after, 8 to me seems like the hands down winner, 4 may be cheaper but at a signal loss. between the two brands, if there is a real world gain one over the other, that is what I am after. the all out ultimate, one time purchase.
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Old 2-Mar-2020, 2:43 PM   #19
jrgagne99
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Originally Posted by mikmaze View Post
... more is more ...
Unless the beamwidth becomes too narrow to get the signals from the different azimuths.
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Old 3-Mar-2020, 9:25 PM   #20
mikmaze
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my setup currently has the antenna on a simple pipe, not guy wired. Does it look like it would be worth going up another 10 or 15 feet and guy wiring for a clearer shot at cleaner signal? I have messed with the settings on the height field in rabbit and see improvement, just not sure how much it would help.
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