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Old 30-Dec-2018, 1:32 PM   #1
k man
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Outdoor antenna advice

Hello all,
I am looking for recommendations for an outdoor antenna set up.

Any help is much appreciated


Happy 2019!

K man


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Old 30-Dec-2018, 3:03 PM   #2
rabbit73
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Happy 2019, k man!

Is this the same location as your previous thread?
Which Outdoor TV Antenna? 18-Sep-2016, 9:34 AM
http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=16098

The report looks similar:





The problems to be solved in this thread are very similar to the problems that had to be solved in your previous thread.

The solution this time will depend upon what channels are most important and how many TVs. You have to make some choices or your antenna system will be very complicated.

Attached Images
File Type: jpg k manTVFreport18-Sep-2016.JPG (209.0 KB, 616 views)
File Type: jpg k manTVFreport12-30-2018.JPG (190.0 KB, 610 views)
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Last edited by rabbit73; 30-Dec-2018 at 10:58 PM.
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Old 30-Dec-2018, 9:08 PM   #3
rabbit73
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Signal report from rabbitears.info for comparison:



This shows channel changes for Hartford by the FCC Repack:
https://www.rabbitears.info/market.p...&callsign=wtnh

https://www.rabbitears.info/repackch...=&lss=&status=

for Springfield:

https://www.rabbitears.info/market.p...&callsign=WGGB

https://www.rabbitears.info/repackch...=&lss=&status=

Most of the channels you want are from Hartford and are strong. You can get them with a UHF antenna like an Antennas Direct DB4e or C2V and no preamp. The C2V is being replaced with the C2MAX. Add the accessory reflector if you get the C2MAX.

The problem comes with ABC. You will need a separate antenna for ABC and a preamp.
You have the weak WGGB in Springfield, now on UHF real channel 40, but moving to channel 26 during Repack Phase 8, 1/18/2020 to 3/13/2020.
https://www.fcc.gov/about-fcc/fcc-in...ition-schedule

You also have the weaker WTNH from New Haven on VHF real channel 10. It will require a separate high gain VHF antenna like the Stellar Labs 30-2475 or 30-2476 and a preamp.

You will have to do some experiments to see which ABC you can get, and then figure out a way to combine it with your Hartford UHF antenna.

How many TVs will be connected to the antenna?

If you want me to study the problem further, give me your exact address and coordinates in a PM to protect your identity, and I will look at the signal lines in a satellite view.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg k manTVFmap12-30-2018.JPG (105.2 KB, 602 views)
File Type: jpg k manTVFreportRE3.JPG (192.1 KB, 601 views)
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Last edited by rabbit73; 31-Dec-2018 at 2:36 AM.
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Old 31-Dec-2018, 2:37 AM   #4
k man
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Thanks for the quick reply

Yes, it is the same report- since i posted last, i have installed roof mounted antennas that do a pretty good job for me. In non technical terms, i have a vhf antenna pointed northeast 50 degrees, combined with a uhf antenna pointed southeast 130 degrees.

I am only posting now to see if they’re is a better solution for my uhf channels ( my vhf pointed northeast works great)

The problem i have with my uhf is some stations get spotty, jittery reception with wind, and my guess is because the uhf antenna i have is too directional

I get great reception all the time from:
Wvit, wfsb, and wcct.

I get spotty reception (especially from wind) from”
Wtic, and wedh

So, looking at my report, would you say a non directional uhf antenna to be better than a directional?

If so, i am looking to replace the uhf antenna i have now.

Thanks,
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Old 31-Dec-2018, 2:42 AM   #5
Nascarken
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Ok so it sounds like you should probably go up 10ft highter and add an amp like the channel master 7777,amp!! Good luck
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Old 31-Dec-2018, 3:11 AM   #6
rabbit73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k man View Post
Yes, it is the same report- since i posted last, i have installed roof mounted antennas that do a pretty good job for me. In non technical terms, i have a vhf antenna pointed northeast 50 degrees, combined with a uhf antenna pointed southeast 130 degrees.
What are you using as a combiner?
Quote:
I am only posting now to see if they’re is a better solution for my uhf channels ( my vhf pointed northeast works great)
What VHF antenna are you using and what VHF channels does it get?
Quote:
The problem i have with my uhf is some stations get spotty, jittery reception with wind, and my guess is because the uhf antenna i have is too directional
That is a symptom of trees in the signal path.
Quote:
I get great reception all the time from:
Wvit, wfsb, and wcct.

I get spotty reception (especially from wind) from”
Wtic, and wedh
That is a symptom of trees in the signal path.

Quote:
So, looking at my report, would you say a non directional uhf antenna to be better than a directional?

If so, i am looking to replace the uhf antenna i have now.
I don't know, you haven't told us what UHF antenna you are using. The C2VJ and the C2MAX I suggested above aren't too directional because they have a wide beamwidth.

Are you using a preamp?

What ABC channel do you get?

I gave you my advice in post #3.
My advice is free, but has no guarantee.
Take it or leave it; it doesn't matter to me.

It's your antenna, your money, and your choice.
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Last edited by rabbit73; 31-Dec-2018 at 4:13 AM.
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Old 31-Dec-2018, 6:54 PM   #7
Tower Guy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nascarken View Post
Ok so it sounds like you should probably go up 10ft highter and add an amp like the channel master 7777,amp!! Good luck
Extra height might help, but watch out, WFSB is too strong for a 7777 preamp.
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Old 3-Jan-2019, 2:59 AM   #8
k man
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Ok, here is what i know

Installer put a digitenna dt-f for my uhf, and a directional 4 6 log vhf of some kind.

They are combined and preamped- i have no idea on this set up, amp is powered down in garage with an electro line amp.

Channel summary

Channel 22 (wwlp)- great most of the time, glitchy with thunderstorms and bad weather only.

Channel 40- rock solid, so much so, i use fox and abc out of Springfield more than hartford.

Channel 30 (wvit) rock solid
Channel 20 (wcct) rock solid
Channel 24 (wedh) not reliable, slightest wind ruins it
Channel 61 (wtic)- sucks, same as channel 24 really.
Channel 3 (wfsb)- rock solid

I am really just looking to keep what i have, and improve channel 24.

Thanks,
Dave
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Old 3-Jan-2019, 4:06 AM   #9
rabbit73
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Thank you for the additional information, Dave. I thought it was overload, but you are getting weaker channels. I thought it was direction, but you are getting good and bad from the same direction. That just leaves antenna aim and trees.

Can you show us a photo of the antennas and a view of looking SE at 149 degrees?

If you tell me your address and the coordinates of your antenna in a PM for privacy, I can look at a satellite view of the signals lines and see if there are any obstructions. If not, I can't figure it out and blame the trees. Does reception improve when the leaves fall?
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Old 3-Jan-2019, 3:13 PM   #10
Nascarken
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Well kman it's time for a 7777 CHANNEL Master amp I live in your city and town's
and I Suggest you go up with the ANTENNA to improve your receive!!!
And dount worry about over load becuse of the lay of the land!!

Last edited by Nascarken; 3-Jan-2019 at 3:15 PM.
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Old 3-Jan-2019, 9:31 PM   #11
Tower Guy
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I believe that your existing preamp is overloaded. The clue is that you are having problems with real channel 31. An overloaded preamp causes third order intermod, which in this case is likely caused by real channels 33 and 35 mixing together to create interference on channel 31.

Can you remove the preamp from your system and try it without amplification? (Unplugging the preamp is not a valid test)
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Old 4-Jan-2019, 2:10 PM   #12
ADTech
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If the problems are with UHF signals that should be of adequate strength and when the wind blows, the underlying problem is always due to trees.

The only 100% reliable solution to tree-related reception issues includes the word "move" - as in the move the antenna, move the offending tree, or pick up and move to a new location without the trees. While once can nibble around the edges of the problem with amps, different type/style of antenna, or similar measures that can offer some improvement, none are assured of solving the problem.

This is not a new phenomenon, it was also an issue back in the analog days although the manifested symptoms were different. With analog, such signal impairments usually manifested as snowy video, ghosting, rolling or tearing video, loss of audio or color, etc. An interesting read from an antenna installer in the UK describes his experiences in this archived article from 1990: http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/referen...-reception.pdf Another article by the same guy in 2010 reiterated the issue for digital: http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/articles/whatsat-trees.pdf
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Old 4-Jan-2019, 3:02 PM   #13
Nascarken
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Yes and when the wind blows and over load in mass is not likely
And that is why antennas like the Winegrud 8200U and the HDB,91
Have a front and a back side so on the strongest TOWER'S use the
Back SIDE of the antenna and you will not get OVER load
So if you go up another 10ft with the ANTENNA set-up with a channel master amp
And buy the way!!what kind of ANTENNAs are being used!!
Well can you get 69.1 ion out of newlunden ct
Becuse I can receive it frum zip code 01129
With an ANTENNA Direct 91xg and I get wtnh,channel 8
And on my back side WWLP 22
And if you're antennas are to close together it will do the same thing too??

Last edited by Nascarken; 4-Jan-2019 at 4:08 PM.
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Old 4-Jan-2019, 7:39 PM   #14
rabbit73
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I don't think we have enough information about k man's (Dave) antenna system and location to give him any good advice about improving his reception as he requested. He has intentionally withheld the details about his equipment, we don't know what his system looks like, and what his location looks like from the ground and from a satellite view.

At this point, any advice we give him is just guess work.
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Last edited by rabbit73; 4-Jan-2019 at 7:50 PM.
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