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Old 2-Aug-2014, 1:33 AM   #1
tydeck77
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Pine Tree Fringe

Hello

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...e1c6579348a74a

I don't know what's next. With my current rooftop antenna for some reason the only channels I'm pulling are VHF.

I can get KMGH and KUSA, Denver VHF channels.

The antenna I have is a UHF/VHF combo and is huge. It's older so don't have any kind of model number. It was on the house I moved into but is probably 8 feet long by 5 feet wide. It has the big VHF "V's" on one end and the UHF end on the other.

I don't understand why I can't sniff a UHF channel.

I've tried every angle on the roof including multiple placements. I'm on a 30 foot pole, but that doesn't get the height to the top of the hill that the house is at the bottom of.

I've tried different places on the roof, replaced the transformer, ran the antenna directly to the TV, essentially everything I can think of.

I really only want the big 4. ABC, CBS, NBC, FOX

The plot makes it look like in theory I could get them from Denver or Colorado Springs.

I'm about half way in the middle of both cities, but am at the bottom of a hill with pine trees all around.

Strange thing is I messed around with a Mohu Leaf indoors and could get a couple of the UHF Denver channels (FOX, CBS) here and there, but the roof almost makes it worse?

I've got an idea for my own Aereo with a Simple.TV and a hard drive with good internet, but can't do anything unless I have a single coax with everything.

Thanks in advance.
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Old 2-Aug-2014, 9:00 AM   #2
teleview
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I recommend remove and discard the old antenna.

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For reception of the Denver Tv stations.

KMGH Real VHF high band channel 7 ABC.

KUSA Real VHF high band channel 9 NBC.

KBDI Real VHF high band channel 13 PBS.

KRMA Real UHF band channel 18 PBS. Rocky Mountain PBS.

KTVD Real UHF band channel 19 MyNetwork and Me-Tv.

KCNC Real UHF band channel 35 CBS.

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YES the antenna/s can be moved off the roof and installed at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions in the direction/s of reception.

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Install a http://www.antennacraft.net.

Y10-7-13 , VHF high band channels 7 thru 13 antenna aimed at about 324 degree magnetic compass direction.

And install a , Antennas Direct , DB8e , Current UHF channels 14 thru 51 antenna aimed at about 323 degree magnetic compass direction.

http://www.amazon.com.

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Install the Y10-7-13 antenna at about 3 feet below the DB8e antenna on the same antenna mast.

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Here is how to aim antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

Use a Real and Actual magnetic compass to aim antenna , do not trust a , cell phone , tablet and etc. compass.

As always , antenna aim and location can be adjusted for best reception.

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Install a ,

http://www.antennacraft.net.

10G221 preamplifier.

Connect the Y10-7-13 VHF antenna to the VHF connection of the 10G221 preamp.

Connect the DB8e antenna to the UHF connection of the 10G221 preamp.

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As a Test to prove reception , run a New Continues Length of Coax through a open door or window direct to 1 Tv , No couplers , No splitters .

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If reception is OK , can then install other components.

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For 1 Tv connected use No splitter.

For 2 Tv's connected use a , Holland Electronics , HFS-2D , 2 way splitter.

For 3 Tv's connected use a , Holland Electronics , HFS-3D , 3 way splitter.

Buy the , HFS-2D , HFS-3D , splitters at , http://www.hollandelectronics.com , or , http://www.amazon.com.

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As you know by now , trees in the path of reception are Not friendly to reception.

The closer trees are in the path of reception the more disrupted reception will be.

The further away are trees and other obstructions are from the antennas in the directions of reception the better the reception will be.

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This 10 foot tripod antenna mount might be useful for a antenna mount on the roof or at some other location.

http://www.ronard.com/712.html.

Use the , ronard(712-50-10) .

http://www.ronard.com.

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The Tv Tuner must channel scan for the ATSC Digital Broadcast Tv Stations/Channels.

Do Not Channel Scan for Cable Tv Channels.

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Digital Tuners can develop - Digital Glitches - that are not cleared out with simple channel scans.

To clear tuner do Double Rescan.

http://www.wchstv.com/DoubleReScanAlert.pdf.

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Also the Tuner in the Tv might be defective.


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Also can Test reception of the Colorado Springs Tv Stations.

Aim the antennas at about 169 degree magnetic compass direction.

Looking for.

KTSC Real VHF high band channel 8 PBS. Rocky Mountain PBS.

KDRO Real UHF channel 24 ABC.

KKTV Real UHF band channel 49 CBS.

KXRM Real UHF band channel 22 FOX and CW.

KOAA Real UHF band channel 42 NBC.

Last edited by teleview; 10-Aug-2014 at 4:10 PM. Reason: Clarify information and typos.
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Old 2-Aug-2014, 7:38 PM   #3
tydeck77
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Posts: 7
Thank you for the advice.

Do you think I have a better chance with the Denver channels then?

If I were to go for the Colorado Springs channels, the only VHF you mentioned was PBS which I don't need.

In that case would I just go with the UHF antenna?
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Old 2-Aug-2014, 10:46 PM   #4
tydeck77
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One other question.

Is there value in going with the DB8E? Or would any DB8 work?
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Old 2-Aug-2014, 11:10 PM   #5
teleview
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Denver , Colorado Springs , Both Directions are a Test of Reception.

The Signal Strength of Reception in Both Directions are Very Weak Signal
Strengths.

The Number 1 Concern is Avoiding Obstructions of Any Type or Kind in the Directions of Reception.

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Recommend start with Test of receiving Denver stations first.

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As to receive or not receive Real VHF high band channel 8 PBS in the direction of Colorado Springs.

That is your choice.

During the Testing Phase of reception you will have both antennas connected so aim both antennas at Colorado Springs Tv transmitters after the Denver Test of reception.

If during the Testing Phase , if Colorado Springs UHF Tv stations prove reliable reception.

After the Test of Colorado Springs Tv reception , then the 2 antennas can be turned back to the Denver Tv stations.

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Then as a choice , you can install a -->Separate DB8e UHF Channels Antenna<-- aimed at Colorado Springs Tv Stations.

The Separate DB8e antenna -->Will Not Be Connected<-- to the Y10-7-13 antenna and DB8e antenna combination aimed at Denver.

If a Separate DB8e antenna is installed , then also install a , http://www.antennacraft.net.

10G201 preamplifier.

Remember the Denver Complete Antennas System.

Is/Are Not connected to the Colorado Springs Antenna system.

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And even so , you may have to dice up the reception situation different ways , receiving some Tv stations from Denver and some Tv stations from Colorado Springs.

The Testing Phase will give you information of how the receptions and directions of reception will happen.

One example and not the only example is , the Y10-7-13 VHF antenna is aimed at Denver and DB8e UHF antenna would be aimed at Colorado Springs , and connected to a 10G221 preamplifier.

And their would be no Separate DB8e UHF antenna and 10G201 preamplifier.

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Here are Tuners/Tuner Recorders that can be connected to provide reception in the directions of Denver and Colorado Springs.

http://www.epvision.com.

With Tuner/Tuner Recorders , a antenna rotator will not be required to receive Tv stations both directions.

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This following information is Very Important.

The closer obstructions are in the directions of reception the more disrupted

reception will be.

The Tv signals are Very Weak Signal Strength so reducing the signal

strengths with obstructions in the directions of reception is Not Good.

Avoid obstructions in the directions of reception.

The closer obstructions of all types and kinds are in the directions of

reception the more disrupted reception will be.

The further away obstructions are away from the antennas in the directions

of reception the better reception will be.

Last edited by teleview; 13-Aug-2014 at 3:17 AM. Reason: Clarify information and typos.
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Old 8-Aug-2014, 2:47 AM   #6
tydeck77
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Posts: 7
Seems like I'm back to square one.

I didn't hear any feedback on any DB8 or if the DB8e was necessary so bought and installed this:

http://www.mcmelectronics.com/produc...-2430-/30-2430

Now the only channel I get is KBDI (Real 13). For some reason no matter which way I angle the antenna I can usually get at least some signal.

Is this hopeless? A lot of what I've read in other posts is trees are horrible for UHF. There is literally no way I can avoid them at my house.
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Old 8-Aug-2014, 4:43 AM   #7
teleview
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I am not saying it is hopeless.

The Best practice for Reliable Reception is to install antenna/s at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions in direction/s of reception.

The closer obstructions are in the direction/s of reception the more disrupted reception will be.

The further obstructions are away from the antenna/s in the direction/s of reception the better reception will be.

I am not saying it is hopeless.

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The Current Broadcast Tv Stations/Channels that are being Transmitted and Received in the , USA , Canada , Mexico , are.

VHF low band channels 2 thru 6.

VHF high band channels 7 thru 13.

UHF band channels 14 thru 51.

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Your reception location has Receivable Broadcast Tv Stations/Channels in the.

VHF high band channels 7 thru 13.

The Y10-7-13 antenna is for reception of VHF high band channels 7 thru 13.

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Your reception location has Receivable Broadcast Tv Stations/Channels in the.

UHF band channels 14 thru 51.

The DB8e antenna is for reception of UHF Tv channels 14 thru 51.

----------

You have the , Stellar Labs / MCM - #30-2430 antenna that is the same type of antenna as the , DB8e .

So use the Stellar Labs / MCM #30-2430 in place of the DB8e .
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Old 9-Aug-2014, 8:54 PM   #8
tydeck77
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Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 7
Thanks for the reply and your continued advice.

As a last resort I moved the antenna off the roof and placed at ground level as far away from the pine trees as I could.

And I'm in business!

I'm pulling CBS, ABC, FOX, and CW from Colorado Springs.

Still waiting on the pre-amp to be delivered, so I'm hoping there are some NBC signals hiding in there.

2 other questions if you don't mind.

I never realized just how much loss there is in the signals, but I'm not currently able to split the signal. Are the splitters you recommended helpful there?

If there is no NBC in the coax I may put the old antenna back on the roof since I was getting that VHF Denver channel there. Is there a good coupler/joiner you would recommend?

The goal would be to get all signal in 1 coax so I can run it through a Simple.TV but not a deal breaker.

Again, thank you!
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Old 9-Aug-2014, 10:53 PM   #9
teleview
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The Colorado Springs Tv station , KOAA-DT , NBC. Real UHF band channel 42 , (virt) virtual number (5.1) .

Is Very Weak Signal Strength at , Positive 0.7 NM(dB).

The preamplifier will Yes most likely make reception possible.

Some further adjustments of the UHF channels antenna that is aimed at Colorado Springs will most likely be required.

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What is the make and model number of preamplifier you have ordered??

And will be arriving at your house??

If it is the 10G201 preamplifier , the 10G201 preamplifier is a single input VHF/UHF antenna amplifier.

---------------

If it is the 10G221 preamplifier.

The 10G221 preamp is a Split Band Preamplifier.

The 10G221 has separate inputs for a VHF channels antenna and a UHF channels antenna.

If the VHF/UHF antenna is connected.

Then the VHF/UHF antenna will be connected to the VHF input of the 10G221 preamp.

And the UHF antenna that is aimed at Colorado Springs will be connected to the UHF connection of the 10G221 preamp.

When connected this way.

Only the VHF channels of the VHF/UHF antenna will be amplified.

I have listed the VHF channels that are received from Denver.

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And as you have done with the UHF antenna that is aimed at Colorado Springs.

The VHF/UHF antenna will receive better if the antenna is at or moved to a location that is not obstructed by trees and other obstructions.

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So that more Tv stations/channels , both VHF and UHF from Denver can be received.

And to Avoid Interference Issues of 2 separate antenna systems connected on to one coax.

Because you will be expecting to receive the UHF Tv stations/channels also from Denver.

--->--->I recommend connect the VHF/UHF antenna as a Complete Separate Antenna System that is not connected to the Colorado Springs antenna system.

Install a.

http://www.antennacraft.net.

10G201 preamplifier.

Connected to the VHF/UHF antenna and run a separate coax and splitter and etc. to the Tv , Tv's location/s.

A ePvision tuner/tuner recorder will be connected at the Tv location/s for reception of the Denver VHF and UHF channels.

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And Yes the signal strengths of reception locations are --->Very Weak Signal Strengths<---.

This is what I am saying and doing my best to provide as information and how to receive the Very Weak Signal Strength Tv Stations Channels of the Colorado Springs and Denver Tv Stations/Channels.

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If only 1 Tv is connected then Do Not use a splitter.

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The HFS splitters are for connecting the amplifier to more then one Tv.

The HFS splitters have a , Diode , that allows power from the amplifier power supply/power injector to flow one way out to the preamplifier unit.

The HFS splitters , Diode , prevents the electric power that powers the amplifier , from Back Feeding through the coax system out to the Tv / Tv's locations.


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As you have discovered , and I have been saying over and over again , and I will say it again.

Install the antenna/s at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions of any type or kind in the directions of reception.

And Yes the antennas can installed down low to the ground or at any height above ground.

Last edited by teleview; 10-Aug-2014 at 4:00 PM. Reason: Clarify information and typos.
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Old 12-Aug-2014, 2:51 PM   #10
StephanieS
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Posts: 442
I would expect with an open line of sight and the Y10713 pointed to magnetic 315 you should be able to accomplish reliable reception of KUSA (NBC), KMGH (ABC) and KDBI (PBS) from Denver.

How about a posting a picture of the antenna you currently have on the ground? If it already has robust VHF support and its in good shape, a money saving option would be to turn it into a VHF only antenna for Denver and let the DB8e work Colorado springs. Combine via a RCA TVPRAMP1R preamp, which will allow for both antennas to be unified into one coax coming into the home.

Teleview's suggestion though is excellent of a two antenna solution (DB8e and Y10713) gives you a nice option of the strongest Denver and Colorado Springs broadcasts. The result would give you full network coverage with a mix of both markets

Cheers.

Last edited by StephanieS; 12-Aug-2014 at 2:55 PM.
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Old 12-Aug-2014, 5:32 PM   #11
teleview
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As I understand it , the Stellar Labs / MCM #30-2430 , UHF antenna is installed at about ground level and aimed at Colorado Springs.

The #30-2430 UHF antenna is a same type and kind of antenna as the DB8e UHF antenna.

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Not knowing the condition of or make and model of the VHF/UHF antenna that , tydeck77 has.

I recommended discard the VHF/UHF antenna and install the , Y10-7-13 , DB8e , for maximum reception.

Yes the VHF/UHF antenna can be used to Test for and reception of the Denver and Colorado Springs Tv stations.

--------------

For the best reception , it is Important to install any antenna at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions of any type or kind in the directions of reception.
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Old 19-Aug-2014, 5:27 PM   #12
tydeck77
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Thanks again, and correct.

I have the MCM #30-2430 pointed to Colorado Springs at ground level and am pulling my UHF.

I put the old Antenna with just the VHF elements back on the roof and am pulling Denver channels 7 and 9 from there.

Into the RCA Pre-Amp which is combining the signals.

All good except for me losing the Denver VHF channels in any wind/rain, and sometimes randomly at night.

I think the signal is just pretty weak. I'll try getting a newer VHF only antenna for that down the road.

Thanks again for all the help!
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Old 19-Aug-2014, 7:44 PM   #13
teleview
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As always , is best to install antenna/s at a location that has the least amount to no amount of obstructions of any type or kind in the directions of reception.

As you have discovered , the terrain obstructions all around your reception location make for odd reception situations.

The hills and mountains can 'Bend' the Tv signal , producing hot spots and cold spots at different heights and locations.

The idea is to probe with the antenna to find the best spot for reception.

The best reception for the antenna can be down low to the ground or up high above the ground or any where in between.

And the location of the antenna is also important.

-------------

I have a question , is that very weak UHF , NBC channel of Colorado Springs received now , with the preamplifier connected??

Last edited by teleview; 21-Aug-2014 at 7:44 PM. Reason: Clarify information and typos.
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Old 21-Aug-2014, 3:32 PM   #14
tydeck77
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Nope, wasn't hiding in the line.

I am pulling the Denver VHF NBC channel though with my old antenna. I think I'll eventually need to upgrade that one though since the signal is lost anytime there is any weather.
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