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Old 25-Jun-2020, 5:53 PM   #1
derf
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Help. Not getting channels I should be getting

Have a Clearstream antenna mounted in the attic with a Channelmaster antenna amplifier/splitter feeding two televisions. One TV has a built in tuner and the other is a video projector with a small tuner box. The tuner box is not recognizing two local channels that are closer and stronger than some of the channels it is getting.
Is it possible to have a signal that is too strong?
Should I look for a different tuner box?
Any suggestions or links to previous threads on this appreciated.
Regards,
Derf
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Old 25-Jun-2020, 8:07 PM   #2
Tim
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Originally Posted by derf View Post
Have a Clearstream antenna mounted in the attic with a Channelmaster antenna amplifier/splitter feeding two televisions. One TV has a built in tuner and the other is a video projector with a small tuner box. The tuner box is not recognizing two local channels that are closer and stronger than some of the channels it is getting.
Is it possible to have a signal that is too strong?
Should I look for a different tuner box?
Any suggestions or links to previous threads on this appreciated.
Regards,
Derf
You can definitely have problems especially if you have too much amplification. Try running your feedline directly to the tuner box without the amplifier/splitter and see what you get.

Is the other TV with the built in tuner working OK?

How much feedline do you have between the antenna and amplifier/splitter?

How much feedline between the amplifier/splitter and the TV with built in tuner?

How much feedline between the amplifier/splitter and the tuner box?

Which mode Clearstream antenna are you using?

Which model amplifier/splitter (or are they two separate pieces)?

Can you post a link to your RabbitEars report? You can generate a report here: https://www.rabbitears.info/searchmap.php

Inquiring minds want to know.
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Old 25-Jun-2020, 8:23 PM   #3
derf
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Hi,
Thanks for the reply.
RabbitEar report:
https://www.rabbitears.info/searchma...tudy_id=112047
The two channels I'm having trouble with are the yellow highlighted channels.
Have this antenna:
https://www.amazon.com/Antennas-Dire.../dp/B004H1NDLG
This amp/splitter:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
About 20 feet from either TV to the amp/splitter. About 5 feet from antenna to amp/splitter.
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Old 25-Jun-2020, 11:05 PM   #4
Tim
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Originally Posted by derf View Post
Hi,
Thanks for the reply.
RabbitEar report:
https://www.rabbitears.info/searchma...tudy_id=112047
The two channels I'm having trouble with are the yellow highlighted channels.
Have this antenna:
https://www.amazon.com/Antennas-Dire.../dp/B004H1NDLG
This amp/splitter:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
About 20 feet from either TV to the amp/splitter. About 5 feet from antenna to amp/splitter.
Well, to start with, the antenna you have is designed for UHF channels only. WAFB and WBRZ are VHF-Hi channels. You need a separate element for the antenna to pick up VHF-Hi. See the picture.

You can order a kit to add that to your antenna.
https://www.amazon.com/Antennas-Dire...CMG/ref=sr_1_3

There are other things, too, that could be the problem, but the first step would be to have the correct antenna.
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Old 25-Jun-2020, 11:16 PM   #5
derf
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Thanks. Will try that add-on.
Not sure why TV2 gets those channels but TV1 won't get them.
Perhaps TV2 has a better tuner built in.
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Old 25-Jun-2020, 11:50 PM   #6
Tim
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Originally Posted by derf View Post
Thanks. Will try that add-on.
Not sure why TV2 gets those channels but TV1 won't get them.
Perhaps TV2 has a better tuner built in.
Yes, tuners vary. Your signal level may be right at the border line--just barely enough for the good tuner and not good enough for the poor tuner. Hopefully adding the VHF element will garner enough signal improvement to make things work for you.
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Old 26-Jun-2020, 12:10 AM   #7
derf
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Thanks. I'll let you know.
It would be nice if the ad for the antenna was clear about what it works for and what it doesn't.
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Old 26-Jun-2020, 4:42 PM   #8
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Thanks. I'll let you know.
It would be nice if the ad for the antenna was clear about what it works for and what it doesn't.

The product listing explicitly states what it is designed for.



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Old 26-Jun-2020, 4:56 PM   #9
derf
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Granted. But, not knowing any better, one might assume all DTV broadcasts are UHF.
The ad does not state that you can get an add-on device to expand the range to VHF.
Also, still not sure how to tell if a channel is UHF or VHF, what frequency range, etc.
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Old 26-Jun-2020, 6:40 PM   #10
Tim
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Originally Posted by derf View Post
Granted. But, not knowing any better, one might assume all DTV broadcasts are UHF.
The ad does not state that you can get an add-on device to expand the range to VHF.
Also, still not sure how to tell if a channel is UHF or VHF, what frequency range, etc.
VHF-Lo Channels 2-6 (uses an antenna with wide elements)
VHF-Hi Channels 7-13 (uses an antenna with medium width elements)
UHF Channels 14-36 (uses and antenna with smaller elements)

This pertains to the "real" channel assignment that the station is using--the actual frequency assignment assigned by the FCC that they broadcast on. In your RabbitEars report that is the channel number shown in parenthesis.

For example your WGMB Fox 44 TV station actually broadcasts on channel 24, but they market themselves as channel 44. This is because a few years ago when TV transitioned from analog to digital, the stations wanted to keep their current branding identity when they moved to their new channel assignments. Your ABC affiliate WBRZ 2 is no longer on channel 2, they are now actually broadcasting on channel 13, but they still identify as channel 2. Confusing isn't it?
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Old 26-Jun-2020, 7:23 PM   #11
derf
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Quite confusing.
Thanks.
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Old 26-Jun-2020, 9:45 PM   #12
OTAFAN
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Originally Posted by derf View Post
Thanks. Will try that add-on.
Not sure why TV2 gets those channels but TV1 won't get them.
Perhaps TV2 has a better tuner built in.
Hi derf:

Tim is correct in the reply he gave your above comment. But there is probably another possibility.

Because you're so close to the towers of the channels in question (less than 10 miles) and their strong signal strengths, you probably could use a metal coat hanger out your window or in your TV antenna jack to pick up their transmission! Laughable but true!

For instance, here at my location in SOCAL LA/OC, I have sometimes used the AD ClearStream Flex indoor antenna which is designed for both UHF/VHF-H. I can pick up a very strong VHF-L real channel 4, display 22 with about a 19 signal meter reading. The "digital cliff" is about 15 where you will no longer receive the transmission; so 19 is weak but watchable. And this is not uncommon with any UHF antenna, such as you are using. However, if you want to receive those VHF-H stations reliably, you need at least that add on Dipole kit Tim recommended. It works good for what it was intended. (And in my case here, I use outdoor antennas that include VHF-L to get good reception on those frequencies.)

Here are several links that might be helpful in explaining the dynamics of Television. I have found them useful:

www.tvanswers.org

https://otadtv.com

www.hdtvprimer.com

Hopefully, this will help clarify somewhat. All the best.....

Last edited by OTAFAN; 26-Jun-2020 at 10:00 PM.
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Old 26-Jun-2020, 10:18 PM   #13
derf
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Thanks. The add-on that Tim recommended should be here tomorrow. I also think WLFT may be coming in too strong. It dropped out briefly a few times today and was a bit noisy.
May try an attenuator if it persists.
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Old 26-Jun-2020, 10:47 PM   #14
Tim
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If the cause is a too strong signal, you could try just a splitter instead of the amplifier you are using. Your local home improvement big box store should have a splitter in stock. You possibly could try it and if it doesn't work return it. Over amplification of strong signals can cause reception problems. But I would try installing the VHF element first before going down that route.
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Old 26-Jun-2020, 10:57 PM   #15
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I have a few good splitters already.
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Old 28-Jun-2020, 6:30 PM   #16
derf
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VHF add-on arrived and was installed. The two channels in question are coming in loud and clear now. Thanks.
I tried with a splitter instead of the amp/splitter but signal strength was low on some channels so the amp/splitter was reinstalled and things seem to be good now.
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Old 28-Jun-2020, 6:34 PM   #17
derf
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Another question.
Based on the RabbitEars graph, should I consider removing the reflector on my antenna? Channel 30 is the channel we watch most and it's about 180 degrees from everything else.
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Old 28-Jun-2020, 6:39 PM   #18
Tim
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VHF add-on arrived and was installed. The two channels in question are coming in loud and clear now. Thanks.
I tried with a splitter instead of the amp/splitter but signal strength was low on some channels so the amp/splitter was reinstalled and things seem to be good now.
Glad it worked out for you and thanks for letting us know the result!
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Old 28-Jun-2020, 6:44 PM   #19
Tim
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Another question.
Based on the RabbitEars graph, should I consider removing the reflector on my antenna? Channel 30 is the channel we watch most and it's about 180 degrees from everything else.
Are you having trouble with receiving that channel? If not, I wouldn't touch a thing, but if you are having problems you can certainly give it a try. You can always put it back on if it doesn't help.

Just note that channel 30 is so close to you and so strong, if you are having receiving problems there is a slight possibly it could be signal overload due to your amp. Have you tried that station with and without the amp to see what the difference might be?
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Old 28-Jun-2020, 6:55 PM   #20
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Channel 30 was pixelated and dropping out with the splitter instead of the amp. I think it's better with the amp.
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