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Old 15-Apr-2012, 8:35 PM   #1
Ellie
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Senior Citizen needs help w/antenna reception

Hello everyone,

I'm another "newbie" seeking information on antenna reception...

I've recently moved to a 2nd floor apt. (facing West) in a semi-rural area and using an indoor antenna which pulls in about 11 channels in the green area of the attached TV Fool analysis. That's great! But, it does NOT pull in PBS (channel 10.1) also in the green area. However, the antenna does pull in channel 23.1 (FOX) which is in the yellow area on the chart...

Current Antenna: Amplified Indoor (RCA ANT1251R)
TV Fool Analysis: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...3616db9dffe8c6


What do I need to do to pull in PBS? Do I need a different type of antenna?
Any help would be GREATLY appreciated by this SS.
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Old 15-Apr-2012, 8:58 PM   #2
GroundUrMast
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If needed, other antennas can be suggested, but for now, let's try to optimize your existing antenna. Try adjusting the length of the dipole rods on each side of the antenna. See the data for channel 10 in the table in post one of this thread: http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=2828

How to aim: http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html
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If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)

Last edited by GroundUrMast; 15-Apr-2012 at 9:12 PM.
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Old 15-Apr-2012, 9:02 PM   #3
elmo
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I can't say I can offer much advice for indoor antennas. I would trouble shoot by attempting to adjust/disable the amplification and see what that does. I'd also try to rotate it based on the transmitter locations on your plot. Or possibly you've done that already? Since I assume indoor is your only option, someone may be able to recommend a good indoor unit.
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Old 15-Apr-2012, 9:28 PM   #4
signals unlimited
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Try adjusting the length of your dipole (rods) to 24". Bring down the gain control down at least 3/4. Fold the rods down to a horizontal position (parallel to the floor). Rotate towards the station and scan or direct enter your channel into your DTV or converter box.
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Old 15-Apr-2012, 9:40 PM   #5
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The rod length is actually 12" on each side to make a 24" total.
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Old 15-Apr-2012, 10:36 PM   #6
Ellie
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Update on Senior Citizen needs help w/antenna reception

Tried several variations of above suggestions. With rods adjusted down to 12.5" each side gives me 4-5 bars reception on all 11 channels... The "adjustment" brought in FOX channel 23.1 (UHF) even better than before; Thanks!

Only problem is, still no PBS channel 10.1 (VHF)... Silly question, but -- could FOX channel signal be overriding PBS channel (see analysis chart in original post)?

If not, can someone suggest another antenna to try? I really miss not having PBS...

THANKS AGAIN!!
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Old 15-Apr-2012, 11:04 PM   #7
signals unlimited
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I worked for a channel 10 and was faced with this exact problem hundreds of times. Tried many antennas, and the ones that worked the best were of the type that you are using. This still may work if you try adjusting the gain setting on your antenna. You can also try other locations and height. Radio Shack can provide you with an extension coax to accomidate that.
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Old 15-Apr-2012, 11:42 PM   #8
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Tv antennas and Tv reception

Is the second floor the top floor , if not , what is the top floor?? Does your unit have , south south west windows , north north east windows , what directions do the windows face?? Is there a balcony?? What direction is the balcony?? Is your unit a end unit?? If so what end , north south east west??
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Old 16-Apr-2012, 1:12 AM   #9
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Channel 8 comes in well I suspect? It's a VHF too. Some antenna's may do well with UFH but no so well with VHF.

If you have an electronics store around, like a Radio Shack or Best Buy, you can see what they have and give them a try. I bought to discounted rerturns from BB and tried them out. One was UHF only. Ended up returning both - nothing lost except some time and gas.

And let me ask this, have you rescanned the channels on the TV? Typically that's required for tuners these days. When I was tweaking my antenna, I always rescanned. Worth a shot.
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Old 16-Apr-2012, 1:12 AM   #10
Ellie
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Apt. building is 3 floors. I am on the 2nd floor. Apt. balcony (all wood) and all windows face West. Apt. is NOT an end unit.
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Old 16-Apr-2012, 2:21 AM   #11
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Tv antennas and Tv reception

As a Test , get a long piece of coax and a coax coupler to connect the long coax to the antenna , use a coax coupler not a splitter to connect the long coax to the antenna. Put the antenna out on the edge of the west facing balcony (do not put the antenna on the floor of the balcony , put the antenna on the hand rail of the balcony) , and aim the antenna at about 250 degree magnetic compass. Here is how to aim indoor type antennas , http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html. The antenna must be plugged in and working.

Last edited by Electron; 16-Apr-2012 at 5:24 PM.
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Old 16-Apr-2012, 3:26 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellie View Post
Only problem is, still no PBS channel 10.1 (VHF)... Silly question, but -- could FOX channel signal be overriding PBS channel (see analysis chart in original post)?
I'd doubt that Fox is the issue. You have two strong FM stations that could be problematic.

When strong FM stations are an issue there needs to be an FM trap between the antenna and the preamp. This limits your choices of antennas to unamplified and if you must use an amplifier, get an FM trap to install between the antenna and an external preamp.

http://www.antennasdirect.com/store/....html?mobile=N
Attached Images
File Type: png Auburn ME FMfool.PNG (212.0 KB, 62 views)
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Old 16-Apr-2012, 4:37 PM   #13
Ellie
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Hi All,

Electron, thanks for your suggestions; will purchase length of coax & coupler on next shopping trip and give that a try... One questions though. You mention "amplifier control full on". My antenna has no amplifier "control", just a thin cord (like a headphone cord) that plugs into base of unit and other end plugs into wall plug... A tiny light on base unit lets me know that the "amplifier" is powered on.

Tower Guy, sorry don't understand about "inserting an FM trap" between antenna & preamp... Antenna has one coax cable permanently attached to base then a separate tiny cord that plugs into back of unit (looks like a headphone jack) with wall plug on other end. Where would I insert a trap(?)

Worst case, can anyone suggest another antenna to try? One that can be amplified and a "trap" inserted if necessary...

Thanks again for your help; it's nice to know that the old brain cells are still working (somewhat)!
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Old 16-Apr-2012, 4:52 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellie View Post

Tower Guy, sorry don't understand about "inserting an FM trap" between antenna & preamp... Antenna has one coax cable permanently attached to base then a separate tiny cord that plugs into back of unit (looks like a headphone jack) with wall plug on other end. Where would I insert a trap(?)
That's right you can't. You need an unamplified antenna.
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Old 16-Apr-2012, 5:21 PM   #15
Electron
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I looked up your antenna and saw that it had no amplifier control and then in my mind I decided it did. ( I have corrected the instructions I gave you by deleting the jabber about the amplifier control.) Any way put the antenna out on the balcony for the test. I recommend do not be concerned with a FM radio signals trap for now.

Last edited by Electron; 16-Apr-2012 at 5:29 PM.
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Old 16-Apr-2012, 5:36 PM   #16
Ellie
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Electron, FYI I did try unplugging the "amplifier" cord and still get reception but not nearly as clear as when plugged in...

In any case, next trip to town will purchase a 20'(?) coax cable and run it out to the balcony as you suggested. Will keep you posted. Again, thanks for your suggestion.
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Old 17-Apr-2012, 2:27 AM   #17
signals unlimited
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ATTN Electron: The adjustable gain on the ANT1251R is not JABBER!....Look it up. It has adjustable gain listed in the specs.
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Old 17-Apr-2012, 3:24 AM   #18
GroundUrMast
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@Electron's suggestion to test reception with the antenna outside the building is reasonable. If the results are good, an outdoor antenna can be suggested.

@Tower Guy's suggestion re. an FM-trap is also very reasonable. In addition to the product link already posted, Radio Shack store are also a source for an FM-trap (RS Catalog# 15-024). There is one major caveat however, an FM-trap will be of little use if used with an antenna with a built-in amplifier... which TG has already pointed out.

Here's a copy of the RCA ANT-1251R user manual from the manufacturer's web site.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf ANT1251R_OM.pdf (473.4 KB, 63 views)
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If the well is dry and you don't see rain on the horizon, you'll need to dig the hole deeper. (If the antenna can't get the job done, an amp won't fix it.)

Last edited by GroundUrMast; 17-Apr-2012 at 5:03 AM.
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Old 18-Apr-2012, 2:56 PM   #19
Ellie
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Hi all,

Spent hrs. yesterday out on deck with extended coax (via coupler) moving antenna around inch by inch .... Absolutely NO reception. Am wondering if this is because I had to disconnect "amplifier" plug from antenna??? Once back inside and in original location plugged in amplifier, did a rescan and picked up original 11 stations (though still no PBS).

Looks like I'm back to square one...
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Old 18-Apr-2012, 3:53 PM   #20
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Tv antennas and Tv reception

The amplified antenna must be plugged in to electric power so built in amplifier will operate. Example: A toaster will not toast the bread if not plugged in.
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