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-   -   Help with antenna selection (http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=16498)

realjet 30-Aug-2018 12:38 AM

Help with antenna selection
 
I posted a thread in Dec 2017. This is an update to that. I have a different lot which is close to the other one but this one is actually higher up. I moved my camper there a few months ago. It has a built in "wingbat" antenna on the roof. There is a built in pre amp in the camper. I am able to get some local stations like ion, pbs, and a few others. I am able to pull in cbs from atlanta but not all the time. Any new recommendations for an antenna?

Here's my new report: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...903838762dbc22

Here's my old thread: http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=16405

I also have a channel master preamp here at my house that I could use. https://www.channelmaster.com/Amplif.../cm-7777hd.htm

Nascarken 30-Aug-2018 2:08 PM

It has to be up higher but the roof mount of the antenna will not let you do so
So get the camper it self up in a higher eluvashion should work well !!!

realjet 30-Aug-2018 4:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60188)
It has to be up higher but the roof mount of the antenna will not let you do so
So get the camper it self up in a higher eluvashion should work well !!!

I should have said that this is a permanent location now for the camper.
I noticed that the stations that I want from Atlanta are all UHF and in basically the same location. Would a good UHF only antenna work?

Nascarken 30-Aug-2018 6:21 PM

Yes go with the solid signal HDB,91 the antenna is on sale with free shipping
And I suggest the channel master 7777-AMP!! And use Rg6, 18 gage solid copper!!!
And use a 3ft tripod on a 10Ft pole? So do a tv Fool report with the Hdb,91,and
The 7777,channel master amp the higth of the camper+the 10ft pole.
Let me know what the tv Fool report is with the ANTENNA set-up?

jrgagne99 30-Aug-2018 6:55 PM

Your TV fool report was only resolved to block level, and so it is likely not accurate. Use the instructions in the sticky thread "A reliable method for generating a TV Fool Reception Report" to get a more precise report. Make sure to zoom all the way in and put the push-pin right on the RV site as seen in the satellite imagery. Enter the expected height of the antenna Above Ground Level- AGL (not the antenna type and pre-amp as prior post suggests). Also, please list the stations you wish to receive (by their call letters) so we can make a proper system recommendation.

rabbit73 31-Aug-2018 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrgagne99 (Post 60191)
Your TV fool report was only resolved to block level, and so it is likely not accurate.

If you look closely at his TVFool report, you will see his exact address, which is consistent with the fact that he gave the coordinates for his former location in his previous thread.

rabbit73 31-Aug-2018 12:43 AM

3 Attachment(s)
Welcome back, realjet

http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...0&d=1535675795

Your new location has higher elevation, which should help, but it isn't the highest in your area.

http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...2&d=1535676634

realjet 31-Aug-2018 1:04 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by rabbit73 (Post 60193)
Welcome back, realjet

http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...0&d=1535675795

Your new location has higher elevation, which should help, but it isn't the highest in your area.

http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...2&d=1535676634

Attachment 3203


This is correct. Please forgive me but I'm not that tech savie.

realjet 31-Aug-2018 1:15 AM

Will this work? I already have the cable and a mast to put it on.

https://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=hdb91x

rabbit73 31-Aug-2018 2:11 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by realjet (Post 60195)
Will this work? I already have the cable and a mast to put it on.

https://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=hdb91x

That is a good UHF antenna that will work for ION or PBS if you aim it at them, but not for your VHF-High channels from Chattanooga, real channels 13, 9, and 12.

It is the real channel number (also called physical channel or RF channel) that determines what antenna is needed.

VHF-Low, real channels 2-6
VHF-High, real channels 7-13
UHF, real channels 14-51

The virtual channel number (like 5.1 or 5-1) is a holdover from the analog TV days to maintain the identity of the station, and is what the TV displays. By convention, the virtual channel number is given in the decimal form to keep it from being confused with the real channel number.

http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...4&d=1535680846

I suggest a Stellar Labs 30-2476 VHF antenna aimed at Chattanooga and your CM7777HD preamp. It might help to tilt the front end of the antenna up a little to catch the signals coming down from the mountain peak. You can mount the preamp a little lower to reach it more easily and play with the high/low gain button.
https://www.newark.com/stellar-labs/...vhf/dp/71Y5462

If you want ION or PBS, try an Antennas Direct DB4E, combined with your 30-2476 using a UVSJ UHF/VHF combiner between the antennas and the preamp.
https://www.amazon.com/Antennas-Dire.../dp/B008PBTPN4

I can't guarantee that this will work, but it is your best chance.

If the antenna is outside, the coax shield should be grounded with a grounding block that is connected to the house electrical system ground with 10 gauge copper wire for electrical safety and to reject interference. For further compliance with the electrical code (NEC), the mast should also be grounded in a similar manner to drain any buildup of static charge which will tend to discourage a strike, but the system will not survive a direct strike.

https://i.imgur.com/RT41tXx.gif

rabbit73 31-Aug-2018 3:15 AM

1 Attachment(s)
This is the problem with the signals from Chattanooga; there is a mountain in the signal path:

http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...5&d=1535685342

Tower Guy 31-Aug-2018 4:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabbit73 (Post 60196)

I suggest a Stellar Labs 30-2476 VHF antenna aimed at Chattanooga and your CM7777HD preamp. It might help to tilt the front end of the antenna up a little to catch the signals coming down from the mountain peak.

I agree that the Stellar Labs VHF antenna is a good choice.

This is one of those situations where you can take advantage of ground gain to tilt the signal up instead of tilting the antenna. If you can figure out the optimum height, the ground gain can be as high as 6 db. For this to work, the slope of the land in front of your antenna must also be considered. The angle from your location to the mountain that will reflect the signals from WTVC is about 2 degrees uptilt.

http://www.qsl.net/oz1rh/gndgain/gnd_gain_eme_2002.htm

Nascarken 31-Aug-2018 9:02 PM

Well I have suggest the HDB,91 which is a uhf only antenna but if you're looking to get
Hi and low band vhf,and looking for the uhf,also go with the Winegrud 8200U ?
With the channel master 7777AMP you will be happy with it lol put this in your tv Fool report and see what you THINK before you buy the antennas that we all have suggest to you!!good luck.

realjet 1-Sep-2018 1:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60199)
Well I have suggest the HDB,91 which is a uhf only antenna but if you're looking to get
Hi and low band vhf,and looking for the uhf,also go with the Winegrud 8200U ?
With the channel master 7777AMP you will be happy with it lol put this in your tv Fool report and see what you THINK before you buy the antennas that we all have suggest to you!!good luck.

How do I put this in my tv fool report?

Nascarken 1-Sep-2018 4:17 PM

Just like the antenna you put in
The first time but put in hdb.91
Or 8200u with a channel master
7777AMP!!??

Tower Guy 1-Sep-2018 6:58 PM

I don’t see the possibility of picking up any low land stations(channels 2-6). Therefore the huge 8200U is much too big and too expensive. I’d use the Stellar Labs antenna aimed at Chattanooga, and then add a UHF antenna aimed whereever you desire to receive a UHF station.

realjet 1-Sep-2018 8:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60202)
Just like the antenna you put in
The first time but put in hdb.91
Or 8200u with a channel master
7777AMP!!??

I'm sorry but I never put a antenna in. I don't see where to.

rabbit73 2-Sep-2018 4:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by realjet (Post 60204)
I'm sorry but I never put a antenna in. I don't see where to.

The reason you don't see where to put your antenna in your report is because there is no place to put it in. You can put your antenna height above ground, but not your actual antenna.

The report assumes that a simple dipole antenna is being used, and gives Noise Margin and signal power based on that. You can add your actual antenna gain to those numbers after you receive your report to see how much it will help.

Nascarken 2-Sep-2018 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tower Guy (Post 60203)
I donít see the possibility of picking up any low land stations(channels 2-6). Therefore the huge 8200U is much too big and too expensive. Iíd use the Stellar Labs antenna aimed at Chattanooga, and then add a UHF antenna aimed whereever you desire to receive a UHF station.

Ha tower Guy!!but soon low vhf will TACK off !!!
And maybe he should probably tack a look at the king Jack design for
The camper with it's new single finder and IT'S RECEIVE of,70 miles.
It's just a lot better than the batwing,ANTENNA lol!!!!

Tower Guy 2-Sep-2018 1:37 PM

What does TACK off mean?

ADTech 2-Sep-2018 7:21 PM

If you were to actually open up and look at what's inside the "King Jack" RV antenna, you'd be far less likely to be so smitten with it. By the way,it's about as blind as a bat on low VHF. Probably -20 to -30 dB net gain before amplification. Even the old Sensar "batwing" style of RV antenna was way better than that on low-VHF.

JoeAZ 3-Sep-2018 2:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ADTech (Post 60208)
If you were to actually open up and look at what's inside the "King Jack" RV antenna, you'd be far less likely to be so smitten with it. By the way,it's about as blind as a bat on low VHF. Probably -20 to -30 dB net gain before amplification. Even the old Sensar "batwing" style of RV antenna was way better than that on low-VHF.

That is all very, very true. However the "king jack" RV antenna is
tuned to the nascar circuit and the others are not......... LOL!!!!!!

Nascarken 5-Sep-2018 4:48 PM

Well thank you for that lol and like I said go for the Winegrud 8200U with a channel master 7777amp and look in to a channel master telescoping mast of 45ft should work well for your location and your campers application or find a good hi tree and mount the antenna to that.it should work very well.

Nascarken 5-Sep-2018 4:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ADTech (Post 60208)
If you were to actually open up and look at what's inside the "King Jack" RV antenna, you'd be far less likely to be so smitten with it. By the way,it's about as blind as a bat on low VHF. Probably -20 to -30 dB net gain before amplification. Even the old Sensar "batwing" style of RV antenna was way better than that on low-VHF.

ADTTeck!!!for get about antennas Direct hi price antennas
Becuse the king Jack will kik there buts,lol!!!:eek:

Tower Guy 5-Sep-2018 5:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60210)
Well thank you for that lol and like I said go for the Winegrud 8200U with a channel master 7777amp and look in to a channel master telescoping mast of 45ft should work well for your location and your campers application or find a good hi tree and mount the antenna to that.it should work very well.

The 8200U is a waste of money. There are no low band VHF stations anywhere near realjet. Realjet remains better off with a high VHF antenna aimed at Chattanooga and a UHF only aimed elsewhere.

jrgagne99 5-Sep-2018 5:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60210)
... go for the Winegrud 8200U ...

This is not a good recommendation because you have no VHF-low stations. The large elements on the 8200U would be nothing more than wind-sails. Further, small RV antennas don't have the gain required for the signals you're after. At least not in the universe most of us live in. :)

ADTech 5-Sep-2018 5:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60211)
ADTTeck!!!for get about antennas Direct hi price antennas
Becuse the king Jack will kik there buts,lol!!!:eek:

Obviously, you've done no serious examination of the antenna you keep suggesting. I would encourage you to do so.

Nascarken 6-Sep-2018 12:22 AM

Wow really you 2 guy's are so funny but I will tell you this much money that you
Spend and I do not care the the antenna that rabbit suggest for hi vhf is a $40dollars
antenna and the HDB-91,that I suggested is a uhf,ANTENNA!! That is $45dollars!!
And know you have 2antennas together so know that you see the right way to set them up is one amp for your vhf? And one amp for your uhf. One a&b switch?
And yes you can put the two antennas together with one amp but. then you do not have the best ANTENNA sistum becuse you do not get the full antenna's performance.lol
That is why I suggest the Winegrud 8200U antenna for that reason it was designed for the
One amp set up lol lol ??

Nascarken 6-Sep-2018 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrgagne99 (Post 60213)
This is not a good recommendation because you have no VHF-low stations. The large elements on the 8200U would be nothing more than wind-sails. Further, small RV antennas don't have the gain required for the signals you're after. At least not in the universe most of us live in. :)

:eek::)but you see you are wrong becuse low band vhf is coming back??
And the way I see it & the Fcc.they suggest that when buying an outdoor tv antenna they say too buy a good hi and low combow uhf/vhf,hi&low outdoor!!
Tv antenna set-up like the Winegrud,8200u.with a 7777Amp!!Ha guy's
For the money one ANTENNA I have used the hi vhf,ANTENNA that Ribbit!!
Suggest I have 2of them stagger stacked with an A&B switching forum vhf/uhf.
And I received channel channel's in North Carolina and South Carolina&so on
With the hi&the low band Vhf.with low band vhf ? And with ATSC,03, with an
LG,TV with the Winegrud 8200U I have staggered stacked two of them &it is
Silly of RECEIVE ?? Better then the DB8,and yes!! Better than the HDB,uhf.only &the ANTENNAS DIRECT 91xg,that's also uhf, with the channel master -7777AMP!! And tech'S say 90miles for uhf.?with the antenna Direct 91&the HDB,91,at a 118Ft hi with the channel master 7777AMP!!90miles
Of RECEIVING in Massachusetts so know let's go back to hi&low band vhf!!!
That you can receive BROADCASTING station for at least 1500miles away??
Silly yes but with two wingard's,8200u,stagger stacked with the uhf/vh f
With an A&B switch and 2,channel master amp.on a 150Ft TOWER!!one
Ham,rotor!! It's the best of the best ANTENNA out there to day!!!
Silly me with my inverted V antenna set-up for my HF,rig!!! Lol,73!!Ribbit.

Tower Guy 6-Sep-2018 2:32 PM

Low band may be coming back in some places, but not his section of rural Georgia.

Adding a UHF and VHF antenna together in a UVSJ prior to a preamp offers outstanding performance.

Nascarken 6-Sep-2018 9:49 PM

Not at all you are wrong about that have you used one I have when you put a vhf&a uhf
Together with the same amp you loos channel's lol

rabbit73 6-Sep-2018 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60222)
Not at all you are wrong about that have you used one I have when you put a vhf&a uhf
Together with the same amp you loos channel's lol

Please explain to me why you lose channels when you combine a UHF antenna with a VHF antenna.

When I combine a UHF antenna and a VHF antenna, I do not lose channels.

A UVSJ is designed to combine a UHF antenna with a VHF antenna without losing any channels. A UVSJ is designed to keep the UHF and the VHF channels separated before combining. Then, when they are combined, you will have all the UHF channels from the UHF antenna and all the VHF channels from the VHF antenna that you had before combining.

The only way you could lose channels is if you combine a UHF antenna with a VHF antenna using a UVSJ and lose some UHF channels that the VHF antenna picked up.

But, that is NOT combining a UHF antenna with a VHF antenna, that is combining a UHF antenna with a UHF/VHF combo antenna. You must use separate coax lines, separate preamps, and an A/B switch for that.

For your information, Winegard uses a UVSJ in the 8200U antenna to combine the UHF and the VHF sections of that antenna. It is called the CB-8269.

http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...1&d=1499537712

http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...1&d=1499537896

It works for Winegard; why doesn't it work for you?

ADTech 7-Sep-2018 12:53 AM

Quote:

For your information, Winegard uses a UVSJ in the 8200U antenna to combine the UHF and the VHF sections of that antenna. It is called the CB-8269.
...and, King Controls uses a UVSJ circuit in the King Jack antennas to combine the UHF and VHF signals post-amplification. I suppose that, if you had followed my suggestion about opening one up and looking at it, that circuit would have been obvious to someone of your great depth of experience.

Nascarken 7-Sep-2018 5:37 PM

Well the box's on the Winegrud when I stagger stacked them the box I did not use?
Silly yes but when you use stuff like that can mess with what you RECEIVE ?
Like I have said before I use the channel master 7777,Amp with the fm,trap?
I have separated the uhf,frum the vhf. On the 8200u. So one amp.for uhf?
And one amp for vhf. With an A&b,switch. For the stagger stacked 8200u.
The hi&low,VHF,receive of,1500,miles away,and the uhf,receive of 90miles away!!
But with one 8200U,with the box's being used with the channel master -7777AMP,with
The fm trap!! Uhf,receive of 85miles,&the vhf,receive of 150miles of RECEIVE,,but I think
If you use 2 amp and do not use the box's the vhf receive will improve it you use an a&b.
Switch??? Yes Rabbit the hi vhf,ANTENNA by it SELF with a channel master 7777amp.
In southbrige MASS 01151 the antenna higth 45ft!!RECEIVE 25, so then I took one of
The HDB91 stacked 4ft and lost like 6 channels so then I used 2 amp one for vhf&one uhf.and yes I got my 6hi vhf channels back that I lost!! I think I needed the hole!!32:dbg
That the channel master amp puts out!!and HDB91 with a channel master amp hooked
To it buy it self!!!REVIVE of,90miles away!!

jrgagne99 7-Sep-2018 6:30 PM

We need a moderator.

Nascarken 7-Sep-2018 9:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrgagne99 (Post 60233)
We need a moderator.

Why!!!what is wrong :eek:

rabbit73 7-Sep-2018 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60234)
Why!!!what is wrong :eek:

It's real simple, Ken.

The original poster realjet stated his reception problem at the beginning of this thread.

We made suggestions about what antenna he should use to receive the channels that he wants.

You made suggestions about what antenna he should use to receive the channels he wants.

And now, you are arguing with us about what antenna realjet should use, wasting everyone's time.

It is realjet's antenna and HIS money, so HE gets to decide what antenna to use, not US.

Nascarken 8-Sep-2018 1:03 PM

Well my decision with him went out the window lol Ribbit yes you do loos channel's
When a hi vhf& uhf are stacked together that's RF. One feed line and amp for vhf/
And the same thing uhf,with an A,B switch?? If you're going too do it do it right ???

rabbit73 8-Sep-2018 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nascarken (Post 60211)
ADTTeck!!!for get about antennas Direct hi price antennas
Becuse the king Jack will kik there buts,lol!!!:eek:

That is rude, Ken.

You are not showing the proper respect to another forum member.

ADTech knows a lot about antennas and reception. He has helped many people improve their reception on this forum and other forums.

If you don't like Antennas Direct antennas, you don't have to buy them, but other users have bought them and been satisfied with the results.

Yes, ADTech does work for Antennas Direct, but he recommends the right antenna for the reception problem no matter what brand it is. He would not recommend an Antennas Direct antenna that is wrong for the job just to make a sale. He thinks like an engineer, not like a salesman, because he has integrity and wants the user to be happy with the results.

Antennas Direct antennas do cost a little more than the cheaper brands, but they are made better, and perform better. If someone buys an Antennas Direct antenna, he can return it if he isn't happy with it. If something is wrong with the antenna, Antennas Direct will fix it. In my opinion, that is well worth paying a little more.

There is too much focus these days on "how cheap can I get it," instead of "how good is it."

I'm happy with the DB4e and the DB2e that I bought. They are well made and perform well; I got good value for what I paid.

Be careful what you say to other posters and show the proper respect. Don't let what happened to you at the atelliteguys.us forum happen to you again, Ken.

Nascarken 8-Sep-2018 11:17 PM

Ha Ribbit freedom of speech rud no he is the one being rude!!! And why are you feeding
The problem this sattlight guy frum destroying our door tv antennas and antennas Direct
Teck!! Should STOP starving trouble with me i thought you would like my experience with
Rf,of vhf&uhf and how using a separate feed line makes a huge difference in uhf,vhf.
And how it works and the best ANTENNA too buy I only suggest and how well they work.
And as far as antennas Direct gos the 91xg!!is there best ANTENNA for get about the DB8!!


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