Help in Northwest Montana
I bought a Clearstream 2V-J3 (or one that looks exactly like it) https://www.walmart.com/ip/Clearstream-2V-J3/24849758 and put it in my attic. I want NBC and CBS but no matter where I put the antenna (I have tried all over my roof too) I can't seem to pick up those stations. I see low-cost antennas on ebay and amazon that have rotators like this one (http://www.ebay.com/itm/HDTV-1080P-O...EAAOxyACJR404W) with good reviews claiming to get 150mi reception, but I'm skeptical and wonder what the best setup for my circumstance would be. I would also like to add another TV in a guest room too.
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...dfafc0247ec2bd |
The 150 mile claims are pure BS.
The C2V is sold at various stores and websites with several variations of the SKU. If you get the antenna out of the attic and up in the air, you'll have a (very) small shot at getting KCFW (NBC) with a suitable preamp. Since CBS comes from the same mountain but is a mere 270 watts on channel 51, you'd either have to move the mountain that is to your south or move away from behind it. There is no other source for CBS that's potentially receivable at your location. Wish I had better news. |
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Yes, ADTech is correct; difficult, but not impossible.
http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...1&d=1478224416 I see these channels on you report; some easier than others: KCFW NBC, real channel 9, Noise Margin 29.9 dB, 11.3 mi, 191 deg true/178 deg magnetic by compass K24ID NBC, real channel 24, NM 12.1 dB, 14.8 mi, 119/106 K12LO CBS, real channel 12, NM 6.9 dB, 14.8 mi, 119/106 KAJJ CBS, real channel 39, NM -2.5 dB, 11.3 mi, 191/178 KTMF ABC/Fox, real channel 42, NM 17.1 dB, 1.4 mi, 276/263 K51HT CBS, too weak K48EO CBS too weak It is the real channel number that determines what antenna is needed. VHF-Low, real channels 2-6 VHF-High, real channels 7-13 UHF, real channels 14-51 I went to rabbitears.info and entered my estimate of your address. If you click on the callsign there, you will see the networks. The callsigns will be listed in virtual channel number order, not strength as in a tvfool report. http://www.rabbitears.info/search.php Then I added Strength Search and antenna height. That gave me this in decreasing signal strength order. I deleted your street address. http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...1&d=1478224625 Then I went to the tvfool interactive map browser to see the green signal lines.' http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opti...pper&Itemid=90 http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...1&d=1478225791 If you mount your antenna at the right spot, the tree behind the house to the south will not block the 191 or 119 path. |
Would you recommend sticking with the antenna I have and getting a "pre-amp" ?
Which one would you get? Is there a difference between a pre-amp and regular amp or is it all the same? Also, I noticed that antennas direct made an amp called a juice, could using the pre-amp increase my chances at picking up that station I want, or is it more about pointing? |
[QUOTE=rabbit73;56722]Yes, ADTech is correct; difficult, but not impossible.
I went to rabbitears.info and entered my estimate of your address. If you click on the callsign there, you will see the networks. The callsigns will be listed in virtual channel number order, not strength as in a tvfool report. does that mean I point the antenna south at 191 degrees to get channnel 9? |
Please wait, I'm not finished with my previous post. It takes me a lot of time to do an analysis and produce the images that will help you.
I'm in the eastern time zone and it's late; if we don't finish tonight, I will come back tomorrow. |
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First aim your C2V loops at K26DD just to see if your system is working. Then aim the UHF loops at 119 for K24ID NBC and the "V" dipole broadside (perpendicular to) at 191 for KCFW NBC. If the signals are too weak add an Antennas Direct Juice preamp and and perhaps an FM filter (if needed) because you have a strong FM transmitter that might interfere with the reception of real channel 9. http://www.fmfool.com/modeling/tmp/2...9/Radar-FM.png https://www.antennasdirect.com/store...on_filter.html If the antenna is outside, the coax shield should be grounded with a grounding block that is connected to the house electrical system ground with 10 gauge copper wire for electrical safety and to reject interference. For further compliance with the electrical code (NEC), the mast should also be grounded in a similar manner to drain any buildup of static charge which will tend to discourage a strike, but the system will not survive a direct strike. http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...9&d=1441917363 |
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C2V > FM trap > preamp > coax > grounding block > power inserter > TV Quote:
You usually do not need a preamp AND a distribution amp; there is such a thing as too much amplification. Try just the preamp and a passive splitter first. |
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Not much of one... With a mere 262 mW of power in your direction from almost 15 miles away, the channel 12 signal from K12LO is unlikely to make it to your location with a sufficient margin above the ambient noise for reception regardless of the data on your plot. This is a case where the simulation engine is probably too optimistic. |
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Oh, Wow; I missed that and went by the noise Margin number in the report and the dBm number from rabbitears.info.
For some odd reason the FCC Longley-Rice K12LO Coverage Map supports the tvfool report; is it also wrong? http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...1&d=1478307815 http://www.rabbitears.info/contour.p...14.03869444444 |
I haven't tried putting the antenna where you put those marks yet, I have been getting about 24 channels without a preamp, including ABC fox (the 23 channels), PBS, Russian Television, and the rest mostly just religious channels. My neighbor is getting channel 9 next door from each of the spots I put a yellow dot with the same antenna. https://postimg.org/image/jj20hrx1n/
Does that site your using tell you where the sweet spot is? I don't understand how to use that, is there a video tutorial somewhere? I am going to order one of those Juice Pre-amps, is that the best one to get since it was designed for my antenna or would you recommend something different? |
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not sure what you mean. This is everything I can get by moving around my antenna. 250 degrees I get the following channels: 26.1 TBN 26.2 TCC 26.3 SBN 26.4 NRB TV 26.5 SOAC 26.6 SLSTV 26.7 WHT 26.8 DAYSTAR 34.1 ANT TV 34.2 RETRO 34.3 WALK 34.4 REVN 34.5 EBRU 34.6 GRIT 34.7 RT 34.8 YOUION 46.1 KUKLHD 46.2 KUKL 46.3 KUKLC 46.4 KUKLW 46.5 KUKLL at 180 degrees I get: 23.1 KTMFABC 23.2 KTMFFOX 23.3 KTMFSWX |
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The information missing from the simulation is the ambient background noise level on the channel of interest which, without a field measurement, can only be estimated. The simulations assume that the noise level is -106.2 dBm, the perfect case. Practical experience has shown that the ambient noise level in the high-VHF band may be anywhere from 5 to 20+ dB higher than the assumption. Subtract that from the calculated noise margin and and you'll see why I'm pessimistic about receiving channel 12. Quote:
Try aiming the antenna towards Bigfoot and give it a scan. When reporting results, it's only necessary to name the first channel on a station, listing the sub-channels only clutters up the report with info that doesn't add anything to the technical conversation. |
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250 degrees I get the following channels: 26.1 K26DD TBN (listed at 276 deg true) 34.1 KMJD ANT TV (276 true) 46.1 KUKL PBS (191 true) at 180 degrees I get: 23.1 KTMF ABC/Fox (The KTMF-LD translator is listed as 276 deg true) The main transmitter for KTMF in MISSOULA, MT is on real channel 23, virtual channel 23.1 (listed as 170 deg). The KTMF-LD translator in KALISPELL, MT is on real channel 42, virtual channel 42.1. |
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http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opti...pper&Itemid=90 To find the sweet spot I walk around with a test antenna in one hand and my signal level meter in the other hand. The sweet spot will vary with frequency; find the best spot for your weakest desired channel and hope that the stronger channels are still OK. http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...5&d=1466633825 http://forum.tvfool.com/attachment.p...6&d=1446858514 Quote:
http://www.fmfool.com/modeling/tmp/2...9/Radar-FM.png FM filter https://www.antennasdirect.com/store...on_filter.html An alternate preamp is the Channel Master 7778. The RCA TVPRAMP1R is less expensive, but of lesser quality. The Winegard LNA-200 Boost XT is of lesser quality. |
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