Help choosing Antenna

[Ryan1984]

Hi,

A few weeks ago I finally convinced the wife to cut the cable, now happily saving over $170/month.

I went to my local Radio Shack, and picked up the only Outdoor Antenna they had in stock, An Antennacraft HDX1000. I mounted it on the roof facing SE, directly in between Boston and Providence. I'm in Northbridge MA. The stations are mostly around 27 Miles away. I get a total of roughly 60 channels. Unfortunately, They're all a little choppy, some more than others depending on which way I turn the antenna.

I want to get all the major channels, FOX, NBC, ABC, CBS, PBS, and CW. My issue is my house is surrounded very tall oak trees. The antenna I have now is on my roof, about 25 FT off the ground pointed directly into trees roughly 15 feet away. I don't think mounting it on a mast is much help either, the trees go over my house by roughly 30-40 feet. There's no where on my property to get away from the trees. The only option is right through them

I'm looking for opinions on a good antenna to get. I believe I'm close enough to the towers that I should be able to get what I want, but I'm not really sure. Here's my TVFool Report (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46ae01877a79ca)

Any insight would be most appreciated

[GroundUrMast]

If not for the trees, a Winegard HD7694P pointed at about 135° magnetic would be plenty of antenna. Given the trees, the HD7698P is not overkill.

[protivakid]

How does Fox 25 come in for you? I live 15 miles west of Worcester but can get ABC, NBC, & CBS Boston with perfect picture, however when I manually select Fox 25 and monitor signals there is not even a blip of a signal. The towers for all these stations seem to be in the same location so I can't figure out why FOX does not come in. FYI, I am using a Mohu Sky HD.

[ADTech]

How does Fox 25 come in for you? I live 15 miles west of Worcester but can get ABC, NBC, & CBS Boston with perfect picture, however when I manually select Fox 25 and monitor signals there is not even a blip of a signal. The towers for all these stations seem to be in the same location so I can't figure out why FOX does not come in. FYI, I am using a Mohu Sky HD.

usually, that means the antenna needs to be moved. Single-channel dead spots are pretty common when using antennas that are broadly directional. You may need to try multiple locations in order to find one where everything will play nice.

[protivakid]

I still have to get back on the roof and point the antenna more toward the source. The Mohu Sky HD claims to be multi-directional but reviews & actual tests say is performs closer to a direction antenna and needs to pointed correctly. I am hoping this will fix my issue as I have it on the most open side of my house. If I were to move it to the other side trees would become a problem.

I could easily live w/o Fox as I hardly watch any TV at all but the gf is the sports fan in the house and from time to time Fox gets the rights to broadcast games.

I also wonder if swapping out the Mohu for a more traditional antenna would help pull in more but then I go back to how the other channels are coming in perfectly fine.

[teleview]

Install a Channel Master CM4228HD antenna aimed at about 100 degree magnetic compass direction.

A in between aim direction of the 2 main groups of Tv stations.

Here is how to aim antennas.

http://www.kyes.com/antenna/pointing/pointing.html.

Use a Old School magnetic compass to aim antenna.

___________

A Winegard DS3000 J pole type antenna mount works well with the CM4228Hd antenna.

___________

Install a Channel Master CM7778 preamplifier.

___________

For 1 Tv connected use No splitter.

For 2 Tv's connected use a , Holland Electronics , HFS-2D , 2 way splitter.

For 3 Tv's connected use a , Holland Electronics , HFS-3D , 3 way splitter.


Buy the HFS splitters at solidsignal.

Here are some places to buy antennas and etc. .

http://www.solidsignal.com.

http://www.amazon.com.

http://www.channelmasterstore.com.
____________________

It might come to getting the antenna higher in the air.

[GroundUrMast]

I still lean toward an antenna that has both UHF and H-VHF capability designed into it intentionally.

If you opt for the CM-4228, I think there's a chance its incidental H-VHF performance would not be enough to receive real CH-12 & CH-13 reliably. If that turns out to be the case, you can add a separate H-VHF antenna though.

[Ryan1984]

I am going to go with the Winegard HD 7698P if I decide the antenna route is still the way I want to go. I have a Tivo Roamio which I enjoy very much, and I like the way it has an on screen guide just like cable for the antenna channels which leans me towards using an Antenna.

However, after canceling the Directv package with Verizon DLS and Phone, I signed up for cable internet only, but along with the internet, the cable also passes every local channel I can get with an antenna, in HD, through the line...The downside being the channels are not numbered usually, they're all over the place...but they're reliable.

I need to think about this some more. Thanks for the help

[protivakid]

I am going to go with the Winegard HD 7698P if I decide the antenna route is still the way I want to go. I have a Tivo Roamio which I enjoy very much, and I like the way it has an on screen guide just like cable for the antenna channels which leans me towards using an Antenna.

However, after canceling the Directv package with Verizon DLS and Phone, I signed up for cable internet only, but along with the internet, the cable also passes every local channel I can get with an antenna, in HD, through the line...The downside being the channels are not numbered usually, they're all over the place...but they're reliable.

I need to think about this some more. Thanks for the help

You lucked out. I did the same and Charter only passed CBS & ABC through my line. No Fox or NBC for me due to the trap they installed on the pole. One guy in a forum told me if I were to bundle their $20 a month Phone service with my internet only package they have to remove the trap for it to work which would also allow all of the basic channels, but I don't want to pay $20 to find out he was full of it.

[Ryan1984]

You lucked out. I did the same and Charter only passed CBS & ABC through my line. No Fox or NBC for me due to the trap they installed on the pole. One guy in a forum told me if I were to bundle their $20 a month Phone service with my internet only package they have to remove the trap for it to work which would also allow all of the basic channels, but I don't want to pay $20 to find out he was full of it.

For some reason, with the cable going directly into the TV, I get all the local stations, but with TV Tivo connected, I also only get CBS and ABC?

[protivakid]

For some reason, with the cable going directly into the TV, I get all the local stations, but with TV Tivo connected, I also only get CBS and ABC?

Very odd. If you do get an antenna up let me know how Fox 25 treats you.

[ADTech]

, but with TV Tivo connected, I also only get CBS and ABC?

Did you run through the complete Tivo online-assisted setup procedure? The Tivo must have either an internet connection or a land-line adapter in order to get the local guide information.

[Ryan1984]

Did you run through the complete Tivo online-assisted setup procedure? The Tivo must have either an internet connection or a land-line adapter in order to get the local guide information.

I've run it through the setup twice, choosing antenna once and cable once. It picks up every channel the cable company puts out, but only 4.1 and 5.1 are not blacked out. When hooked just to the TV, I get Fox25 at 26.1 as well as ABC, CBS, NBC, CW, and more, but they're all over the place. I can just use the TV and put the channels in my favorites through the TV, and that lets me just scan through those channels, making it work for me...But, I can't record anything, which is why I have a Tivo to begin with.

[Ryan1984]

Getting back on thread, I just purchased a HD7698P. I should be putting it up next weekend. We'll see how it goes.

While the cable was decent, at certain times it wouldn't pick up some of the more important channels (FOX, CW) for some reason....that and my wife is pestering me about not having a guide.

[Stereocraig]

Getting back on thread, I just purchased a HD7698P. I should be putting it up next weekend. We'll see how it goes.

While the cable was decent, at certain times it wouldn't pick up some of the more important channels (FOX, CW) for some reason....that and my wife is pestering me about not having a guide.

Titantv.com is a good one.

[Ryan1984]

Mounted the Antenna, Aimed at 135 degrees magnetic, and have the same results as with the little Antennacraft HDX1000. I can view all the channels that I'm supposed to, but they're pixelated and come in and out, extremely annoying.

I connected an amp from Radio Shack, and it boosted the signal a little, but it's still choppy. Completely confused right now, lol. I thought the giant antenna would just work perfectly.

[GroundUrMast]

There's no where on my property to get away from the trees. The only option is right through themMy friends, family and our antennas are all affected by trees. In some cases, I have had to resort to using the biggest antennas available, and still when the wind blows, have trouble with reception. In all these cases, the TVFR would suggest an indoor antenna should be adequate.

The interference produced by moving vegetation can be nearly impossible to overcome by anything less than a chainsaw or tower. In my case, I'm still looking at trees when 90' up.

Most of the RS amplifiers gain is matched by the noise they produce... Consider an RCA TVPRAMP1R.

[Ryan1984]

My friends, family and our antennas are all affected by trees. In some cases, I have had to resort to using the biggest antennas available, and still when the wind blows, have trouble with reception. In all these cases, the TVFR would suggest an indoor antenna should be adequate.

The interference produced by moving vegetation can be nearly impossible to overcome by anything less than a chainsaw or tower. In my case, I'm still looking at trees when 90' up.

Most of the RS amplifiers gain is matched by the noise they produce... Consider an RCA TVPRAMP1R.

I understood that the trees would be difficult to overcome, I guess I just assumed that with a better antenna I'd at least get somewhat better signal. Te signal is about the same as with the old antenna, but overall, I think it's worse because with the HDX1000 I was getting signals from both providence and boston, all be it, not many would be reliable. With this one, I only pickup the channels to which I aim it, and according to my Tivo, right around 50%.

Would it be advantageous to maybe aim it up? I mean above the treeline, Angle it up in the front...Would that help? Or does it need to be level?

I'm going try moving it to different spots on the roof, but There is no where I can get a clearing in the trees on the whole NE-SE side of my house.

[protivakid]

That's odd you are seeing such poor results. I know people bash it but my Mohu Sky HD with it's small included amp is well below the tree line and picks up most channels fine from multiple directions. I am probably 15-20 miles farther from the towers than you as well.

[GroundUrMast]

Double check assembly of the antenna. Pay particular attention to phase lines being connected and routed as per the manufacturer's instructions. Be certain that the phasing lines do not touch the boom.

[Ryan1984]

Double check assembly of the antenna. Pay particular attention to phase lines being connected and routed as per the manufacturer's instructions. Be certain that the phasing lines do not touch the boom.

Did as you suggested. I was careful to make sure they weren't touching when I put it up, and they were not. However, where they go into the black box and sit in the pegs, one side had come out a little and wasn't making contact with the piece that has the cable connector on it. Hard to explain, but anyway, I'm getting ABC, NBC, CBS, Ion (69.1) and Fox at 72 % (according to Tivo) and it's steady. CW comes in about 60% and picture is perfect.

For some reason, I can't get a decent signal on PBS. It's the same direction and distance as ABC and NBC so I understand why. It picks it up at 32%, which is the same thing I get from the Boston stations that I'm not trying to get...makes me think the TVfool Analysis could be wrong, but I'm not sure.
Not a deal breaker, I don't need PBS, just kinda wondering.

Anyway, thanks for the help. Everything is good now. Now I just have to get back on the roof and properly secure everything. One more question, I'm going to ground the Antenna to my electric box, that's where the cable and satellite were both grounded to, I can just take the wire from the dish and move it to the Antenna. Question is, where do I attach it to the antenna?

[GroundUrMast]

Grounding the mast and coax shield are prudent and relatively inexpensive steps that limit the buildup of static-electricity which can damage the tuner. When done correctly, grounding can also reduce the risk caused by a nearby lighting strike.

http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=901

Grounding in a basic system is a two step process:

1) Connect a #10 gauge copper wire to the antenna mast. A bronze ground clamp such as the Halex #36020 is well suited for this application. Run the wire directly to the electrical service ground. Avoid sharp bends in the wire. (If the ground wire between the service panel and ground rod is accessible, an Intersystem Bonding Termination devise can be placed onto the ground wire without cutting or disconnecting it. This provides a means to connect the #10 mast ground wire to the existing ground wire close to the ground rod outside the building. If possible, avoid running the new ground wire inside the building, energy from static or electrical storms is best directed to ground before it has any path into the building. The mast ground wire can be bare or insulated, your choice.) (Examples of Intersystem Bonding Termination devises: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_0_11?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=intersystem%20bonding%20termination&sprefix=intersystem%2Caps%2C357&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Aintersystem%20bonding%20termination)

2) Run the coax from the antenna to a location close to the electrical service ground. Install a ground block and with another piece of #10 wire, connect it to the electrical service ground at the same point you connected the mast ground. (Examples of Coax Grounding Blocks: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_0_16?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=coax+ground+block&sprefix=coax+ground+bloc%2Caps%2C270&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Acoax+ground+block)

I don't recommend short-cuts such as driving a new ground rod that is not connected to the existing electrical service ground. An isolated ground rod often has a high resistance that provides very limited ground connection. The goal is to connect to the same ground system that protects the rest of the home.

Surge protectors located inside outlet strips at the TV, computer or similar devises are worth consideration. A surge protector with a high joule rating is able to absorb more fault energy than a unit with a lower joule rating. Some surge protection units include phone jacks and F-connectors to enable protection of a phone line, coax cable and the power cable(s). However, in the case of an outdoor mounted antenna, this type of protection should not be considered a 'first-line of defense'.