Making a mountain invisible to TV signal?

[msdow]

Hello all,
I just became a member of the group after monitoring for a while. Thanks in advance for the help!

Here is my situation.

The most important item is...I cut the cord!

Now for the question and explanation. What is the best way for me to make the 250 foot butte that is between my house and the transmitter of the stations we really want to get "invisible"?

I live about halfway between Denver and Colorado Springs. There is clear LOS to the Colorado Springs transmitter locations and those stations have been picked up with a cheap antenna in the attic. So far so good. The problem is we have lived in Denver for the past 25 years and REALLY want to get the Denver stations. Very specifically, we are interested in KCNC, KMGH, KUSA, KRMA, and KDVR

Our house is located about 1500 feet above the main transmitter location for the Denver stations and would normally have a clear LOS to those transmitters EXCEPT we live at the bottom of a tall butte (approximately 250 ft) and that butte is between us and the transmitters.

The good news is we own the top of the butte and there is clear LOS to the Denver transmitters on top so can certainly put an antenna there. The bad news is the top of the butte is about 1000 ft from the house.

Here are the possible solutions being considered. All solutions start with installing a high quality receive antenna on top of the butte in the ideal location and orientation. Here is a TVFool report showing my house with a 250ft antenna (to simulate being on top of the butte) http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46ae335f377023. Just FYI and for comparison, here is the link to my TVFool report assuming a 20 ft antenna on my house http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d46aed2f43eb4a8.

1. Put a STRONG preamp (~60dB) at the antenna and simply run RG6 from antenna to house. Alternately, put multiple preamps inline (assuming this will work without amplifying too much noise)
2. Utilize fiber optic with MUX at the antenna and DEMUX at the house
3. Install a second antenna on top of the butte attached to the main antenna. Connect the two antennas with RG6 but make sure they are separated via polarization, rf barrier between them, no LOS, other. Amplify the signal as it enters the main receive antenna and re-transmit it down to the house.

4. Other ideas???

THANKS!!! Mark

[GroundUrMast]

Give the folks at 3starinc.com a call. They handle CATV line amplifiers, RG-11 cable, including direct burial and w/messenger for pole mounting. At 1000' of run, you'll need to consider 'slope loss' (there is more loss at higher frequencies). The CATV line amp will need the right equalizer setting or plug in module. Be sure to confirm the amplifier spec'd is able to handle off air signals without signal level conditioning. In the CATV world, they almost always control the individual channel level going into the distribution amps. If they don't, the strong signals will mix and wipe out other channels.

Fiber is a good option, especially if you're considering LAN connected tuner(s). 50 micron (core size) multi-mode fiber can support Gigabit Ethernet to 1000 feet and beyond. This option would have one or more tuners at the antenna site and you would need a computer connected to your TV to interface the data stream generated by the tuner(s).
http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=820
WiFi is troublesome, prone to packet loss, but this idea would be great with a wire line or fiber Ethernet connection: http://forum.tvfool.com/showthread.php?t=1286

Option three would need to be treated as a transmitter, and be subject to FCC licensing. Not the end of the world, but you would need to deal with the bureaucracy and use commercial grade equipment.

As far as antennas go, quite a number of good choices come to mind. You could make it simple, just go with an all channel antenna and be done with it... I doubt you'll see much use of the Low-VHF (real CH2 through 6) capability but you would be ready to go if any more stations came on the air. The Winegard HD7694P makes good sense, it's smaller, given that it lacks the long elements that would support Low-VHF but has plenty of performance covering real channels 7 to the top of the UHF band.

Can you see a direction that you want to investigate further?

[msdow]

Thank you for your great and thorough response! I am really interested in doing something wireless so I like the idea of using HDHomerun and using a wireless connection.

My current concern is I have had significant trouble using my HDHomerun wirelessly. It works great if I access its content with a computer that is connected via an ethernet cable, but freezes my network when it is accessed wirelessly. Maybe it is time for a new wireless router!

Thanks again and I can keep the group informed of my final solution if there is interest.
Mark

[GroundUrMast]

If you can make a point to point bridge run close to error free while maintaining at least 20 Mb/s throughput, you'll have this nailed...

Here's a bridge kit that looks like it's worth investigating further, http://www.radiolabs.com/products/wireless/bullet-wireless-bridge-kit.php

My experience has been that the 2.4 GHz band WiFi band is plagued by interference from leaky microwave ovens, cordless phones, co-channel WiFi networks, etc. Still, if you use the right WiFi antennas at each end of the link, you have a better than average chance in a rural or suburban environment.

I'd love to hear how this progresses...

[brin831]

if you want to go wifi look no further than

ubiquiti: http://www.ubnt.com/

and if you can provide los ... for your wifi link i'd go 5.8 ghz and then ensure if you have in home wifi you only use 2.4 it should keep any interference low.

however i do think the fiber option is a great thought ... you can get fiber pretty cheap pre terminated and whatever length you would need and instead of using it to extend network you could use it to extend the receive antenna's signal

http://www.skydreams.tv/SkyDreams.TV/FiberAnt.html

http://rfvenue.com/product/rf-optix%E2%84%A2

do not know the cost of the fiber ant, but the rf venue product is in the 650 dollar range ... yes i know not cheap but neither is putting an antenna on top of a mountain !!?? haha.

[elmo]

My current concern is I have had significant trouble using my HDHomerun wirelessly. It works great if I access its content with a computer that is connected via an ethernet cable, but freezes my network when it is accessed wirelessly. Maybe it is time for a new wireless router!

Thanks again and I can keep the group informed of my final solution if there is interest.
Mark

What do you have for a router? I can stream wireless HDHR content w/o much trouble at all. I'm using a WNDR3700 over 2.4ghz; I'm not a fan of the 5ghz freqs. We're all N, no B's nor G's. However I do run some wired in places to make sure the signal is solid.